The Islamic Antichrist And Its War With The West Is Forming

By Walid Shoebat (Shoebat Exclusive)

The news continually is unfolding and the Islamic Antichrist nation of Turkey is on a collision course with the west, so listen up. When the Islamic Caliphate (ISIS) first arose we warned that Turkey’s fingerprints would be all over it. And today, the Economist stated:

“Today the fallout from Turkey’s relations with ISIS knows no end. Its global image is in tatters amid persistent claims of secret dealings with the jihadists, which Turkey denies, of course. Shaky peace talks with the Turkish Kurds are near collapse, because Syrian Kurds in Kobane are still under siege by ISIS as Turkish tanks look on passively. Friendship with America has soured because of Turkey’s refusal to let coalition war planes use the Incirlik airbase to bomb ISIS. Now a spat with Denmark over a Danish jihadist is testing relations with the European Union.

Turkey has also become a haven for ISIS and terrorist runaways. Basil Hassan, a Muslim terrorist of Dane-Lebanese extraction, is accused of attempting to murder Lars Hedegaard, a writer with anti-Islamic views, in Copenhagen. He was caught on April 16th by Turkish police at Istanbul’s Ataturk airport after a tip-off. The row erupted when it emerged that Mr Hassan had been freed by the Turks despite Danish demands for his extradition.

Some speculate that Mr Hassan was part of a hostage swap for the 46 Turks kidnapped by ISIS from the Turkish consulate in the Iraqi city of Mosul in June and released on September 20th while others claim that Mr Hassan vanished before the deal.

Also it is unclear if three ISIS fighters arrested over the murders of a policeman, a soldier and a member of the public in southern Turkey in March remain in custody.

Denmark’s prime minister, Helle Thorning-Schmidt, insists Turkey must face repercussions for its behaviour, though “taking the issue to the EU now would be out of place.” But a Social Democratic rival, Mette Gjerskov, says EU membership talks must be frozen and Danish troops in Turkey on a NATO mission be pulled out. The EU has also condemned the recent intrusion of Turkish ships into Cyprus’s territorial waters. “I see a genuine concern across the political spectrum as to where Turkey stands,” warns Marietje Schaake, a Dutch member of the European Parliament.

Turkey’s hopes of joining the EU were already dented after the government’s response to last year’s Gezi park protests left at least nine dead. Worries over efforts to quash corruption probes against the president, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, and his inner circle, to muzzle the press, to censor the internet and to stack the judiciary were all aired in the EU’s recent annual progress report on Turkey’s accession talks. Yet the government is proposing new laws granting the police sweeping powers, including the right to detain suspects for 24 hours without seeking prosecutors’ consent.

David Cohen, an American treasury official, dropped another bombshell by announcing that ISIS earns as much as $1m a day from illicit oil sales involving “Turkish middlemen”. Turkish officials retort that Turkey sees ISIS as a threat to its own security and that since the start of this year, 60m litres of contraband fuel have been seized and 65 kilometres (40 miles) of illegal pipelines ripped out. Yet until Turkey “unequivocally joins the coalition against ISIS,” warns Marc Pierini, a former EU ambassador to Ankara, doubts over its place in Europe and the West “will only grow.”

Turkey has a dismal record when it comes to freedom of expression, judicial reform, separation of powers, and rule of law and its criticized for displaying increasing authoritarian tendencies and draws attention to the widening gap between the EU and Turkey.

But this phenomenon is not only between Turkey and the E.U. Turkey taking a sideline approach at Kobani will eventually launch ISIS as the victor against the U.S. We shall see that ISIS will reign supreme in Iraq and Syria which will cause a bruise against the U.S. led Coalition and Turkey will be blamed. That with the issue of Armenia is a very special case and those who live in Washington probably hear enough about the Armenian Genocide from time to time. This issue is and will always be a sore issue. The United States was also very disappointed that Turkey didn’t accept the plan before the invasion of Iraq to open a second front through Turkey.

Even Reuters had this to say just last week about Turkey:

Turkey’s leaders have never been afraid of sticking to their guns in the face of international opinion. Both Erdogan and Prime Minister Ahmet Davutolgu are driven by a vision of the Middle East united by a Turkish brand of political Islam. Both believe their foreign policy is supported by moral imperatives, and that they are on the right side of history.

Adding:

But unless Ankara aligns itself more closely with international opinion it will become ever more isolated, and its goals will remain out of reach, many experts believe.

So the West is beginning to see the two very issues we were predicting all along: 1) The vision of Turkey’s imperial plans and “vision of the Middle East united by a Turkish brand of political Islam” and 2) Ankara will become ever more isolated from western powers.

Everything is going according to God’s plan, to allow the formation of the threat spoken of by John. The West and the Muslim world are on a collision course to part ways.

erdogan-turkey

 

From here forward, pay close attention. Had we said two years ago that a small offshoot of Al-Qaeda, ISIS, would establish a Caliphate, control major swathes of territory in Iraq and Syria, analysts would have laughed us off, the United States pulled out listening to such analysts instead of listening to us, since Al-Qaeda was in hiding in Pakistan and Tora Bora. Today such an unusual scenario has become reality. Where are our mockers today?

As ISIS continues to grow and choke nationalism, we will see Turkey in the future working in conjunction to create its Islamic superstate through mergers of Muslim nations. And just as we have seen a Blitzkrieg Arab Spring and ISIS, the Muslims, especially Turkey is patient and at some point in time the showdown will commence with Egypt in which we expect Turkey (king of the north) to dash towards Egypt (king of he south) and the Copts will be massively slaughtered. The Muslim Brotherhood already announced Turkey as the future headquarters of this Caliphate and will come back into Egypt. Currently the Muslim Brotherhood’s rhetoric is anti-ISIS opting for Turkey to re-unite the Caliphate under several superstates and is why Daniel calls it a “divided kingdom”.

Our analysis here will bring mockers, but the unification process will then go in full gear since Turkey in Daniel 11 will enter Egypt, Sudan and Somalia which will all become one (the Muslim state of Qinana) and Turkey according to Daniel 11 will march into North Africa in which Libya, Tunisia, Algeria, Morocco and Mauritania will become one state (Al-Maghreb).

And then we have Gogaz easily and willfully join the Muslim League (Ezekiel 30). This would include Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Turkmenistan, Tajikistan, and Uzbekistan. Ever wonder why its called Gogaz (Gog)? This alone eliminates Russia from the equation.

Currently what we see is an attempted unification between Syria and Iraq making borderless states in order to reverse the treaty of Sykes-Picot. While we are not certain exactly how this new Caliphate Map will be drawn, ISIS currently has them as 13 states.

But if we consider that 3, Europe (Orobpa) , Ethiopia (Habasha), Spain (Andalus) these are Christian lands, which needs to be occupied through force instead of joining voluntarily. So eliminating these initially will have 10 states: 1-Anatolia (Turkey) 2-Kurdistan 3-Gogaz, (C.I.S, which includes Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Turkmenistan, Tajikistan, and Uzbekistan) 4-Khorasan (Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan and possibly Indonesia) 5-Iraq 6-Sham (Syria, Lebanon) 7-Qinana (Egypt, Sudan and Somalia) 8-Maghreb (which includes Libya, Tunisia, Algeria, Morocco and Mauritania) 9-Yemen 10-Hijaz (which includes the Gulf States).

Daniel’s ten toes and John’s 10 horns can now easily be seen as feasible.

If Syria falls (and it will), Lebanon will be taken and the Christians there will be slaughtered until the numbers of the martyrs is fulfilled. The Christian Maronites of Lebanon will put a fight, but will be defeated. They already see the writing on the wall.

 

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As we stated decades prior to Turkey’s Islamist conversion, it will choose Islam’s Ishmaelite Arabism and Babylon as its adhesive to unite clay (weak) and iron (strong) from over 50 Muslim states to later have the most powerful nations of Russia and the West destroy it when the Christian world experiences a great revival (see Ezekiel 28:7-8 Daniel 11:44), that “news from the north” (Russia) will trouble the King of the North (Turkey/antichrist). The Christian world will mark their foreheads with the Mark of Christ while the Muslim world will mark their foreheads with the mark of the blasphemy of Islam–the Shahadatan.

While Islam was the adhesive that put Turkey closer to its Muslim neighbors, Islam became a major concern for western countries. We have already seen riots recently in Germany and Italy and England is not far off from implementing laws to ban terrorists who join ISIS from returning and Europe all tighten its immigration laws. The war between Islam and the West, while its bad news, it has its good news: Christian revival and a desire to resort to militarism, especially in Russia.

All this will further plunge Turkey to look towards Iran in which the two are locked together in their destiny (Ezekiel 38, Revelation 13:2). This beast is the body of a Leopard (Revelation 13:2) (The Greco-Roman) and not European, with its feet of the Bear (Iran).

Ahmet Davutoglu the most influential man in Turkey and the architect of this Ottoman revival. In his book on the role of Asia, he says:

“While other powers redefine their strategies towards Asia in the post-Soviet era, Turkey also needs to redefine its relationship with Central Asia [and include Albania and Bosnia as well], the Middle East, the Far East, and the Black Sea-Caucasus region.

 

Cauc.Cntrl_Asia0

When the Soviet Union disintegrated, the Turks suddenly honed in on Uzbekistan and Tajikistan their long lost ethnic brethren as Turkey became very interested in the Russia-Black Sea-Caucasus area. This region is known biblically as part of Gomer and Beth Togarmah. This unification is currently ensuing.

So stand by and get ready for the great war drumbeats:

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  • RodK1975

    Very interesting… this keeps getting more and more interesting as days go by. Has anyone heard any serious chatter about NATO expelling Turkey? I haven’t but would be very happy to hear about it. The sooner they are out of NATO the better and a spat with Denmark may be a good starting point. One thing I was happy to hear was Nigel Farage saying that the West needed to stop poking the Russian bear with a stick, get this Ukraine situation worked out and start working with Russia to counter the real threat to civilization ISIS/Islam. I really like most of what I hear Nigel Farage say and I hope he and UKIP can gain some control in the UK. Then, if we can just survive the next two years of BHO, maybe we can get a good Tea Party type conservative in the White House and get something moving in the right direction.

  • susan

    Walid, I understand the troubling news from the north (Russia) but I don’t understand the news from the east? If you have time. Thank you! I sure hope we make it. We are so corrupt and we either.can’t or won’t see it….but G-d does.

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  • FF

    Hi mr. Walid.
    Have you ever read something specific about Andaluz relating to being conquered by the beast?
    I’m in Portugal (West side of Iberia) and never found nothing specific.
    In the begining of this year we had a prophecy saying that soon we will be forbidden
    from speaking His name.
    God bless you.

  • shoebat

    Tom

    You ask:

    “Why has this information been missed?”

    Answering this question could mean you becoming upset with me.

    Imagine if me and you were two Jews at the time of John the Baptist and we were expecting a Messiah to come marching to fight the Romans and John tells us He will come to hang on a cross?

    Its too much to fathom for a culture that was weened on a victorious Messiah.

    This news would probably stun both of us to the point we might reject John the Baptist who would be telling us the truth.

    The truth is not an issue n which the famed teachers seek. Only the humble will find truth. Only the ones who seek with all their hearts and minds will find it.

    Sort of as you are doing right now Tom.

    So, if I was John the Baptist and you asked your question above, how must I answer?

    If I told you that the Messiah will come to hang on a cross, I would probably have you shun me off.

    So what must I do to answer your question?

    Must I stun you? Or should I gradually have you seek the truth?

    Today I choose to stun you.

    It was missed for one major reason Tom: Pure Hatred.

    In the opinion of the Albigensians, the Catholic Church was the Harlot of Babylon. This view transferred to the Protestants who look favorably towards the Albigensians. But how many Protestants seriously ever look at the Albigensians?

    This view gymnastically twisted the meaning of Scripture to retro fit the Vatican as Harlot of Babylon. This centered in Europe and so the Vatican had to be harlot, the verses had to fit no matter what they truly said a scenario that was in error.

    It wasn’t the Scripture that was the mold, but the theory became the mold in which the Scripture had to fit the false theory.

    Here, this might help, but don’t hate me for it:
    http://shoebat.com/2013/06/25/vatican-as-the-harlot-of-babylon-debunked/

    If the first error said that Messiah will come to fight the Romans the same error is still today and they think that Messiah is coming to still fight the Romans who were already Christianized.

    You need to read the volumes of material on this website. You still have a mountain to climb, but seek with all your heart, mind and soul, and you will find all the answers to your questions.

    Lord be with you as you quest for Him.

    Walid Shoebat

  • 1Bobby8

    Yes it’s Russia, the hope of the world, that has Christianized and militarized to lead the way for Christian revival and a desire to resort to militarism to fight the anti-Christ.

    • billobillo54

      Bro: I’m still praying daily for the U.S. to be among the “seven princes and eight principled men.”

  • billobillo54

    Thank you Walid. And, God bless you. May God crush those who wish to do you and yours harm. I wonder if U.S. authorities will ever use you as a consultant again? I hope so for our sakes.

  • billobillo54

    Brother: IMHO, It’s also because the Protestants, especially those into prophecy, have simply bought into the LAME “European, gay, secularist antichrist” popularized by Hal Lindsey and others (all great Christians in my book, but in error). They also bought into “Rosh” (Ezekiel 38) as being Russia, when, as GWOT demonstrates, is “chief” (The NASB has a footnote to “Rosh” as “chief”). Also, the misapplication of the Pre Tribulational Rapture has led many to be cocky, lazy, self absorbed and in error. I just finished reading and watching about the U.S. wars with the Caliphate that began during the Revolution with Jefferson, Adams and Franklin sent as ambassadors to negotiate with the Caliphate for two years. The Caliphate ambassador finally informed them that their aggression against our citizens and shipping was due to injunctions in the Koran. This dispute grew until finally Jefferson and later Madison sent the Navy and the Marines to fight and defeat the Muslims of the Barbary Coast. The Muslims later explained that THEY WERE WILLING TO FIGHT AGAINST AMERICA BECAUSE AMERICAN (I.E. PROTESTANT) CHRISTIANS PROVED THAT THEY WERE UNWILLING TO FIGHT. I love the Protestant Church, but this is and continues to be a fact. The fact is also, the Catholics have forgotten their heritage of being champions against Islam or have bought the condemning narrative of the Crusades thrown at them by some Protestants, atheists, Jews,secularists and Muslims. The entire church is infected to a large degree by this pacifist bogus narrative.

    • shoebat

      Thank you Billobillo54 for this insight.

      • billobillo54

        Thanks Walid. I have The Holy Spirit, the Scriptures and you to thank for opening my eyes to the truth. One more major factor (as you have many times pointed out) is the ignorance by Christians of God’s teaming with people to fulfill His prophetic plans. Specifically His political and military plans. (I know you know all of this…I am just reporting to the teacher…You mean He has political and military plans? In the Book of Revelation it states that the Lamb “makes war.” How many times does it say He will RULE with a “rod of iron?” When I pointed out in a Bible study in my little Pentecostal Protestant Church about two years ago the truth of the text in Isaiah 63 our sweet and dear Pastor’s wife along with a few women rebuked me and gasped with horror. So I told them, on the spot, turn to Isaiah 63 and read it yourself. They immediately got the message. They still don’t get that the Jews will fight (e.g. Zechariah 9, Zechariah 12, Zechariah 14, Micah 5, Isaiah 19, Daniel 11:32: “He (i.e. the antichrist) will flatter and win over those who have violated the covenant. But the people who know their God will be strong and will resist him.” Also Obadiah:

        “The people of Israel will be a raging fire,
        and Edom a field of dry stubble.
        The descendants of Joseph will be a flame
        roaring across the field, devouring everything.
        There will be no survivors in Edom.
        I, the Lord, have spoken!”

        And Balaam in Numbers 24:

        “Now I am returning to my own people. But first let me tell you what the Israelites will do to your people in the future….

        I see him, but not here and now.
        I perceive him, but far in the distant future.
        A star will rise from Jacob;
        a scepter will emerge from Israel.
        It will crush the heads of Moab’s people,
        cracking the skulls[b] of the people of Sheth.
        Edom will be taken over,
        and Seir, its enemy, will be conquered,
        while Israel marches on in triumph.
        A ruler will rise in Jacob
        who will destroy the survivors of Ir.”

        Our Bible study leader I just got to read Micah 5 (e.g. seven princes and eight principled men).
        God bless you Walid.

      • RodK1975

        My goodness I love this falafel… I just hate it that I didn’t discover falafel years ago. I have so terribly much to do to get up to speed. Thank you Mr. Shoebat for opening this falafel stand and serving your customers the way you do!

    • RodK1975

      Wow.. Billobillo54! This was very informative for me, Thanks bro!

      • billobillo54

        Bro: Read “God’s War On Terror.” It’s worth a thousand times the price.

        • RodK1975

          Will do. I’m going to order it this week. Thank God youtube has some of Mr. Shoebat’s lectures up.

        • Kamau40

          I agree with you. In addition, every Christian should have or get a copy of GWOT in the their libraries. There is no doubt it beats every prophecy book out there.

    • Kamau40

      Billobill54-
      Everything you said is right on the money. As I am continuing my quest of learning Church History along with the great valuable teachings from Walid, Theo and Julie on this blog, what you said above is very consistent. Thank you.

  • shoebat

    Sorry sir, but thats not on our menu. If you want to eat that your gonna have to try your own toilet.

  • shoebat

    “I also fear for some Western “Christians” because when Isa is revealed, it may cause so much deception that some of those “Christians” would take the mark of the beast”

    This is why you need to make sure that when the time comes, you put the Mark of God on your forehead Trevor. This entails you do not listen to folks who say that that mark is spiritual.

    Remember when the day comes. Remember. Do not forget Trevor.
    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3d/Crossofashes.jpg

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  • Bob Cary

    Walid will be used

  • susan

    I’m curious to see who the players are of the Eastern alliance.

    I am too. I haven’t been able to find Turkey distressing about news from the West, just the East. Now I have NO idea how we would fight Turkey. Perhaps we would come from the East. I just hope we’re relevant after ten more years.

  • susan

    Yes, like you I checked out the world map and I saw what you saw. :-)

  • susan

    Hi Trevor! What does Isa stand for? Obviously I missed something. I want to make sure I put the mark of G-d on my forehead, along with my loved ones. I sometimes think there is more in Walid’s falafel stand than he is serving. That he’s giving us only what he knows we can eat (bear) at this time.

  • shoebat

    Stop blowing my cover, will ya

  • shoebat

    Really?

  • susan

    I suppose that happens when the angels they keep referring to come down from heaven? Thank you,!

  • billobillo54

    That would be a case of taqqya, kitman, muruna and a Hudna treaty all wrapped up in one. But, as Jesus stated when accused of being an agent of Satan: “If Satan casts out Satan his kingdom is divided and he will not stand.” Can it be that you arte irritated by the truth that Islam is the body of the antichrist?

  • RodK1975

    Amen to that Gatekeeper

  • Tom_mcewen

    Well, I hope the catholic Church does not set aside its doctrines and become neither hot nor cold, I like it when 2+2=4

    • Trevor

      No, the Catholic Church will not lay it aside. Perhaps I phrased it poorly. It is my hope that all come together in unity of faith.

  • Alleged Comment

    Paraphrasing Ronald Reagan, you lieberals know so much secrets that just ain’t so.

  • Tom_mcewen

    When it says your comments will be reviewed they disappear while they are being reviewed, then they reappear after being reviewed. Have some patience.

  • Tom_mcewen

    So he is actually 007 and 008?

  • Tom_mcewen

    We have a growing number of protestants coming to Sv Tomase in Malostranske namesti to have their foreheads marked on Ash Wednesday, they come as late as 10 in the evening.

  • shoebat

    Indeed, many will embrace the beast, but John gave strict borders and we must stick with John. Stay on the track; what Scripture said.

  • shoebat

    Molon,

    Thanks for asking, how is everything with you?

    As far as your quest that the 4th kingdom is Europe.

    The prominent Rev. Dr. Matthew Henry over three centuries ago dealt with this controversy regarding the 4th kingdom:

    “Who is this enemy — whose rise, reign and ruin are here
    foretold? Interpreters are not agreed. Some will have the Fourth Kingdom to be that of the Seleucidae and the ‘little horn’ to be Antiochus…. Others will have the Fourth Kingdom to be that of the Romans, and the ‘little horn’ to be Julius Caesar and the succeeding emperors, as Calvin says. The Antichrist, the Papal Kingdom, says Mr. Joseph Mede…. Others make the ‘little horn’ to be the Turkish Empire; so Luther, Vatablus, and others. Now I cannot prove either side to be in the wrong. And therefore, since prophecies sometimes have many fulfilling and we ought to give Scripture its full latitude (in this as in many other controversies) — I am willing to allow that they are both in the right.” (Henry: A Commentary on the Holy Bible, with Practical Remarks andObservations, London: Marshall Bros. Ltd., n.d., IV:1270f)

    So besides the Papal Kingdom (Europe) as a theory, there was also the “Seleucidae” (Seleucid) which is the “Turkish Empire”
    model which was the most prominent view historically. These are not isolated interpretations, even amongst the most major Protestant theologians.

    http://shoebat.com/2014/08/18/antichrist-nation-rome-turkey-get-ready-end-times/

    But you really need to read the whole book, God’s War on Terror. It is about 500 pages just to answer your question

    P.S: Who is Molon Labe? Does that stand for something or someone?

  • shoebat

    the Muslims do not “keep” peace treaties with non-Muslims. They do make peace treaties with non-Muslims called Hudna. Sorry but the “he” can never be Messiah if you follow the actions of this “he”. This is what Doug Bachelor from the seventh day Adventist says, they are wrong.

  • shoebat

    ” I would send you my full legal analysis of scripture for critique unless your mind is closed on the matter.”

    I want to believe, I Believe ;-) Always glad to have iron sharpen iron, regardless that I have been so sharpened that there is no metal left.

  • shoebat

    My dog? He only eats terrorists. Sorry to hear that, but it must be someone elses dog.

  • shoebat

    Someone named their dog Charlemagne? And a poodle? Ahhhh, Amerrrrricans

  • shoebat

    “I admit to skipping around in it as I do in almost everything that I read.”

    Big problem, the instructions on the bottle is not to skip, you must consume the whole prescription as directed on the bottle, 3 times daily before and after meals ;-)

    “I would not attest that I have read every page — although I think many of your conclusions are correct (if I didn’t, I wouldn’t be on this site).”

    No no no now, no skipping pages.

    “I am thoroughly convinced that the seven heads of the
    beast in Revelation 13 and 17 are the same seven “heads” present in Daniel 7. We have to believe that the Roman Empire is the sixth head of the Beast in Revelation 17 — it was the kingdom that existed in John’s day. ”

    Yes, but remember, the Bible gives certain adjustments. For example, the bear rises on one side. The bear as you already know was Medo-Persia. In the end it will be Persia (Iran) without Media (Kurdistan).

    When John says “body of a Leopard” its clear: Greco-Roman.

    Ever wonder why no European nation mentioned in the literal references?

    “Ezekiel 38 mentions “all the bands” of Gomer. I believe
    that these are the Cimmerians, or the Gimmerai. Historically, these were people that settled in Asia Minor and spread into modern Europe.”

    Ezekiel clearly and the Bible speaks of Geographic locations void of people’s migrations. This is why you need to read every word in the book. No skipping.

    “Before we think that it’s a stretch to include any of the Europeans in Ezekiel 38, remember that Turkey is a NATO member. If Turkey were to go to war, the realpolitik of Europe would be to at least support a member-state.”

    Quite the assumption.

    “To me, what is most convincing, is that the European
    nations that were once part of the Roman Empire are far more “Islamic” than the European nations that never were under Roman rule. Look at England — it is full of Islamic extremists. Yet there aren’t nearly as many Muslims in Ireland or Scotland. Isn’t that strange? England and Scotland share a common border — yet the one that never really fell to Rome has a very small Islamic presence. If you look at a map of Islam in
    Europe, it is eerily similar to the boundaries of the Roman Empire.”

    Yes, by you are projecting the future here instead of sticking with the text.

    “So Walid, look to Daniel 11. From where are the “tidings” that trouble the Little Horn (Antichrist) leading to Armageddon? They are from the North and the East. They are not from the West.”

    This refutes your proposition. North of Europe is an ocean and even north of Russia is an ocean but north of Turkey is Russia.

    So I guess I am at a loss of what your point is.

    “John says that Rome is one of the six “kingdoms”
    associated with the Beast. The Beast is not troubled from the west. Why? I believe it is the growing pestilence of Islam in Europe.”

    This is why you skipping is a problem. In the book it discusses the Ships of Chittim (The Europeans, read Josephus) which are Italy, Spain and Greece which come against him.

    You get an A+ on your Scriptural analysis, but a C+ on skipping chapters.

    P.S. From now on, thy name shall be called Leonidas:

  • shoebat

    Molon,

    In my replies I do not fully address where I think you err, and is why you really need not to skip and re-read since its all addressed in the book which left no table unturned, I whipped everyone and made sure that I flipped all the tables in the Temple.

    For example, you insist that Europe is involved because its the 6th head, but you ignored to examine that the “head” is constituted when that empire fell and not when it was at its imperial greatness. It fell in Constantinople not Rome which ceased to be the Roman Empire (read Gibbons)

    As far as the bear rising on one side, have you skipped what the book stated about one of the greatest in Prophecy, Sir Robert Anderson and what he wrote on the bear rising on one side?

    As to the Ships of Chittim, your proposition that the ships simply “come” from direction of Chittim is found wanting for the simple reason that the text says “Ships of Chittim” and not “Ships from Chittim”. Remember, when it comes to text I am a perfectionist and when it comes to writing me with perfect English without a single grammatical error, you are a perfectionist. I am beginning to profile the historian in you.

    As far as the (C) it was a C+ but since thou art Leonidas and I am standing at an edge of a well, you do not have to give either earth nor water, you get an A+ for being the King/Queen of Sparta. After all THIS IS SPARTA.

  • shoebat

    “The fourth head of the leopard should be understood as “Rome” and not “Macedonia”

    Certain words of wisdom from Sir Robert Anderson himself, certainly more learned than this flimsy Shoebat:

    Certain writers advocate an interpretation of these visions which allots the “four kingdoms” to Babylonia, Media, Persia, and Greece. This view, with which Professor Westcott’s
    name is identified, claims notice merely in order to distinguish it from another with which it has been confounded, even in a work of such pretensions as The Speaker’s Commentary (Vol. 6., p. 333, Excursus on the Four Kingdoms). The learned author of the Ordo Saeclorum (Ch. 616, etc.), quoting Maitland, who in turn follows Lacunza (Ben Ezra), argues that the accession of Darius the Mede to the throne of Babylon did not involve a change of empire. These writers further urge that the description of the third kingdom resembles Rome rather than Greece.

    According to this view, therefore, the kingdoms are 1st Babylon, including Persia, 2nd Greece, 3rd Rome, 4th a future kingdom to arise in the last days. But as already noticed (p. 32, ante), the book of Daniel expressly distinguishes Babylon, Medo-Persia, and Greece as “kingdoms’ within the scope of the prophecy.

    [11] Daniel 7:19-27. On this vision see Pusey, Daniel, pp. 78, 79

    [12] The state of Europe at or after the dismemberment of the Roman Empire has been appealed to as a fulfillment of it, ignoring the fact that the territory which Augustus ruled included a considerable district both of Asia and Africa. Nor is this all. There is no presumption against finding in past times a partial accomplishment of such a prophecy, but the fact that twenty-eight different lists, including sixty-five “kingdoms,” have been put forward in the controversy, is a proof how worthless is the evidence of any such fulfillment. In truth the historical school of interpreters have here, as on many other points, brought discredit upon their entire system, containing, as it does, so much that claims attention (see App. 2.) Note C).

    But there is no doubt that Egypt, Turkey, and Greece will be numbered among the ten kingdoms; [27] and is it not improbable in the extreme that these nations will ever accept the leadership of a man who is to appear as the champion and patron of the Latin Church? A striking solution of this difficulty will probably be found in the definite prediction, that while the ten kingdoms will ultimately own his suzerainty, three of the ten will be brought into subjection by force of arms (Daniel 7:24.)

    Turning again to the West, the names of France, Austria, Italy, and Spain present themselves; and seven of the kingdoms are thus accounted for. Can the list be completed? Belgium, Switzerland, and Portugal remain, and these too would claim a place were we dealing with the Europe of today; but as
    it is the future we are treating of, any attempt to press the matter further seems futile. It has been confidently urged by some that as the ten kingdoms were symbolized by the ten toes of Nebuchadnezzar’s image, — five on either foot, — five of these kingdoms must be developed in the East, and five in the West. The argument is plausible, and possibly just; but its chief force depends upon forgetting that in the prophet’s view the Levant and not the Adriatic, Jerusalem and not Rome, is
    the center of the world.

    • Molon Labe

      Flimsy? Walid I might call you flabby, but not flimsy. Flabby as you might be, I enjoy your references. Thank you.

      For me, I found Sir Robert Anderson’s calculations on Daniel’s 70th week to be mind-blowing when I first encountered it as a teenager. His precise calculations from Nisan of 445 BC until Passover of 32 AD made the Book of Daniel come alive to me like never before. I think the sage of Scotland Yard was onto the non-European nations before most Western Christians and I very much respect his work.

      The reason that I do not include Macedonia (Greece) as one the four heads of the leopard is simply because of Daniel 11:3-4. After Alexander’s death, his kingdom would be divided, “Not to his posterity, nor according to his dominion which he ruled: for his kingdom shall be plucked up.” To me, this means that the four heads of Daniel’s leopard do not include Macedonia, or Greece-proper. Alexander the Great was a Greek – his “posterity” was Greece, and his dominion was over the Corinthian League and Macedonia. In fact, we use this same term – posterity – in the US Constitution to refer to our perpetuating nation.

      I am persuaded that the lion of Daniel 7 is Babylon, the bear raised on one side is Persia rising over the Medes, and the leopard is the Hellenic Empire and its four notable quarters – Ptolemaic Egypt, Seleucid Syria, Thrace-Pergamum and the Roman Empire. Clearly, ONE of the four heads of the leopard is the Roman Empire – Rome is unarguably the sixth head of the beast in Revelation 17.

      I also believe that the two legs of Nebuchadnezzar’s statue represent the northern and southern confederations of Daniel 11. I don’t believe that the two legs represent the Western Roman Empire and Eastern Roman Empire, nor do I believe that the legs represent Europe and the Levant. Rather, I see the focus in Daniel 11 on the Syrian alliance and the Egyptian alliance in the last days. I see the statue as North-South, and not East-West. When Israel was divided, it had a northern kingdom and a southern kingdom. I feel Daniel 11 tells us that much about the Beast, since Iraq, Iran, Egypt, Assyria and Turkey are part of the configuration.

      I do not believe that the nations of Europe will be part of the ten toes on the statue. However, I do believe that Europe will be so influenced by its growing Islamic population that will have political ties with the Caliphate. This is why I feel that the Beast is not troubled from the west (Europe).

      Obviously, Anderson’s point is that we cannot possibly identify the ten kings who will receive their kingdom one hour with the Beast. Looking at the Middle East right now, maps could be redrawn quickly. Per Revelation 17, we know that these kings receive their kingdoms for “one hour” with the Beast, a very short time. Perhaps not coincidentally, the same amount of time there is silence in Heaven.

      • shoebat

        We shall see and remind.

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