Erdogan Wants To Revive The Islamic Empire Of The Antichrist On Easter Sunday, The Day That Jesus Christ Resurrected From The Dead. Many Christians Will Be Deceived And Will Join The Antichrist As He Sits In The Temple Of God And Makes War Against Christendom

By Walid Shoebat (Shoebat Sunday Special)

“All the leaders of the EU countries went to the Vatican and listened to the pope submissively. Do you now understand why they have not been taking Turkey into the EU for 54 years? The situation is quite loud and clear, it is a Crusader Alliance. April 16 will also be the day to evaluate this,” President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan said at a rally in Ankara on April 2.

Erdogan will change history on April 16th. This is Easter or Pascha. This is the day Christ resurrected from the dead after becoming the sacrificial lamb of God. Resurrection day is the day that Christianity’s argument was cemented in history, for without it there is no Christianity.

Instead of commemorating this day for Christ’s resurrection, Erdoğan chose it to cement his Ottoman resurrection from the dead. It is also the day, according to Erdoğan, when Muslims must decide on what to do with the Crusaders in what Erdogan termed as the “clash between the Crescent and the Cross”.

For Erdoğan’s victory over the Cross he is calling on all Turks in his nation and throughout Europe to vote ‘yes’ and approve his referendum coming April 16th. To Erdoğan, Turkey then will decide whether to continue its attempt to connect with Christendom (join the E.U) or whether it will appoint Erdoğan as “the Prince” then resurrect its wounded Ottoman Empire to war with Christendom in the future. Turkey’s rise to a Caliphate system was explained by Hayrettin Karaman, Erdogan’s main Fatwa giver who stated:

“What this [presidential system] looks like is the Islamic caliphate system in terms of its mechanism. In this system the people choose the leader, the Prince, and then all will pledge the Bay’ah [allegiance] to him”.

Turkey is also enforcing more state control over the church preparing the way for doing what is to come: the Abomination of Desolation.

When will this culminate will take some time, but we already see its beginning phases. Whether Erdoğan is this Antichrist remains to be seen. If so, he will eventually prohibit the temple sacrifices.

This brings up a crucial issue: what entails this abomination of desolation? 

THE TEMPLE CONTROVERSY 

AND HOW TO PREPARE FOR THE ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION

On the abomination of desolation Jesus in Matthew 24:15 commands we focus on the book of Daniel. But Daniel’s prophecy has three fulfillments: the abomination of desolation in Daniel’s day involving the first temple; the abomination of desolation in Jesus’ day involving the second temple; and then finally the abomination of desolation in the time of the end involving Christ’s temple. In other words, the holy of holies, where God’s sacrifice resides will be desecrated. So with a New Testament era, the perspective changes forms, especially when it comes to The Temple of God. What is it?

However, there are several controversies on how do we resolve this issue. A recent interpretation is the re-institution of the Jewish sacrificial system in a rebuilt temple which a small cult in Jerusalem called The Temple Institute leads. For decades we have heard about such efforts. To many, the construction of the Third Temple articles seems like a partial fulfillment which to these it confirms a literal temple was what Jesus meant when He referred to Daniel’s prophecy.

Chaim Richman, international director of the Temple Institute, standing next to a replica of the holy ark at an exhibit of Third Temple vessels in the institute’s offices in Jerusalem. (Ben Sales/JTA)

This interpretation of course came way later. It is this new rebuilt 3rd temple many believe that will be the one Antichrist desecrates which they see the establishment of the Temple Institute in Jerusalem as evidence of their view. The other interpretation is the traditional one which argues that when such notion came about as a temple building, Christ was speaking from a completely different mindset referring to His Body as the Temple (John 2:19). This body was not only Himself, but included the entire Church in whole as His temple:

“We heard him say, I will destroy this temple made with hands, and within three days I will build another not made with hands.” (Mark 14:58)

So it is obvious, this temple of God is not made by human hands. The historic Christian interpretation was that this involves the perpetual sacrifice of the Eucharist. Lorenzo Scupoli (1530 – 1610) explains from Revelation 12:

“Therefore, when we overcome the enemies, it is the blood of Christ which overcomes, as it is written in Revelation: ‘and they overcame him” (the slanderous devil) ‘by the blood of the Lamb’ (Rev. xii. 11).

By the “blood of the Lamb” Scupoli explains:

“This most holy sacrament, this all-conquering weapon, or rather Christ present in this sacrament, can be actively received in a twofold manner: first, sacramentally, in the sacrament of Christ’s flesh and blood, with the necessary preparation, that is, contrition, confession, purification by penance and the required fast; secondly—inwardly and spiritually in mind and heart. The first may take place as often as outer circumstances, inner state and the discretion of one’s spiritual Father allow; the second can take place every moment; so you may always have this all-powerful weapon in your hand and constantly wield it against your enemies. So harken to this and partake of the Holy Mysteries of Christ as often as possible, so long as you have the permission of your spiritual Father. But strive to partake of Christ our Lord inwardly and spiritually without ceasing; I have offered you guidance to this in the preceding chapters on prayer.”

So which one is the correct interpretation? The latter interpretation is becoming more rejected by anti-Catholic Christians who would claim that “overcoming by the blood of the lamb” is spiritual which stands for “our faith in Christ”.

But to traditional Christians, the Eucharist has everything to do with the unfolding “abomination of desolation” spoken of by Daniel the prophet: “he will stop the sacrifice and grain offering” involves the desecration or the prohibition of the Eucharist for if we knowingly consume what is desecrated or reject to consume the Body of Christ then we have desecrated the very Temple of God.

Others take a completely spiritual view that “overcoming by the blood of the lamb” is simply spiritual which stands for “our faith in Christ”. But if the spiritual application is true, that “overcoming by the blood of the lamb” stands for “our faith in Christ”, the Jesus-style question is this: how then can Antichrist abolish what only resides in the heart?

This is the Jesus-style question no denier can answer. Antichrist therefore must abolish a substance, this is either the Eucharist including the wine or the Temple animal sacrifices.

But it is here where the prophet Joel predicted this war with Antichrist. Joel debunks both views of ‘spiritual’ and ‘the animal’ sacrifices:

“The grain offering [Bread] and the drink offering [wine]. Have been cut off from the house of the Lord [the Temple]; The priests mourn, who minister to the Lord … Alas for the day! For the day of the Lord is at hand; It shall come as destruction from the Almighty.”

Joel clearly does not speak of either the exclusively spiritual or of the animal sacrifices, for we “drink His blood” (“drink offering”) and “eat His Body” (“grain offering”) and this prophecy speaks of literal “priests” mourning just before the coming of “the day of the Lord”.

This is definitely what sparks the Second Coming “the day of the Lord”.

Indeed, this is the crux of the whole battle between chaff and wheat, between heresy and orthodoxy, between the sons of God and the sons of Antichrist. To the traditionalist, it is the Eucharist that Antichrist wants to abolish and it is by the Eucharist we conquer Antichrist.

There is no other way to go around this issue. Rejecting the Eucharist is why many anti-Catholics believe that its all about abolishing a Jewish sacrificial system in a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem.

For Scupoli there is the tangible (the Eucharist, the sacrament of Christ’s flesh and blood) and for the modern Third Temple promoters, they have the wrong tangible and for all others they must stop applying the tangible to be exclusively spiritual. Sure faith is inwardly and spiritually in mind and heart, but it is also by outward expression through the sacraments of Baptism and Communion.

Therefore, Antichrist attempts to abolish the “daily sacrifice” yet he fails to accomplish this completely because it will continue on being practiced underground.

One other nail in the coffin of naysayers is this Jesus-style question: do you see this “daily sacrifice”? 

Jesus comes in the flesh in the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass which is observed daily in Catholic and Orthodox churchesnot weekly, monthly, yearly or never as is commonly done by non-orthodox.

“Daily” means “daily”.

So why do all these divisive movements ignore the word “daily” if indeed they ‘love and only obey the scripture’?

There is only one way out of this dilemma. That is to claim that such “Daily Sacrifice” is regarding the re-institution of the Jewish sacrificial system.

But such interpretation turns upside down the whole crux of Christian theology; Christ’s sacrifice makes null and void the ancient Temple sacrifices. If temple sacrifices are to be re-instituted, the other Jesus-style question would be: was Malachi in error when he predicted that these sacrifices will be done in “every place” and that God will “shut the door” completely to animal sacrifices?

This becomes a major dilemma since Malachi is clear:

“Oh that there were one among you who would shut the gates, that you might not uselessly kindle fire on My altar! I am not pleased with you,” says the Lord of hosts “nor will I accept an offering from you.” (Malachi 1:10)

Here God speaks clearly that He will no longer accept these offerings. No other offering is accepted except the one that God describes so clearly in Malachi:

“For from the rising of the sun even to its setting, My name will be great among the nations [gentiles], and in every place incense is going to be offered to My name, and a grain offering that is pure; for My name will be great among the nations [gentiles],” says the Lord of hosts. (Malachi 1:11)

This confirms with absolute certainty that it is this “Daily Sacrifice” of communion “grain” (not animal) which is done “daily” “from the rising of the sun even to its setting” and its done amongst the “nations” (gentiles) and it is “in every place” and not just in a single location as in a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem and that it has “grain” and “incense”, tangible substances that also represents spiritual meanings.

Christ warned that even a virgin will enter hell for slumbering on such issues. This “daily sacrifice” which is a “grain offering that is pure” is practiced “in every place”. This is in every true assembly in His Temple which is a grander scale than just a single building in Jerusalem.

So crucial was this that Christ Himself warned to heed Daniel’s warning regarding this issue when He warned of “the Abomination of Desolation spoken of by Daniel the prophet” which is clearly explained in Matthew 24: 151621 Daniel 8:1311:31; and 12:11. The scripture calls this a “daily sacrifice”. And by this, it eliminates all these divisive interpretations by many whose religious institutions do not observe this perpetual sacrificial system “daily”. Again, “daily” means “daily”.

So if this “daily sacrifice” happens “in every place” this alone destroys the arguments that this practice happens in a single rebuilt Jewish temple exclusively in Jerusalem. Therefore, small cult like groups like the Temple Institute is not ordained by God, but is influenced by the spirit of Antichrist. This is done in order to undermine Christianity and to deceive Christians to abandon the true sacrificial system.

This “pure grain offering” links directly to the same “grain offering” in Daniel’s prophecy which Christ instructed us to carefully pay attention to, where Antichrist will stop the “grain offering”.

If this is not the Eucharist and is regarding the re-instituted temple sacrifices, the other Jesus-style question would be this: how could Malachi’s  prophesy, which biblical scholars agree, these verses make null and void Jewish sacrificial system all of the sudden allow a re-construction of a cancelled system?

“One among you who would shut the gates” of the temple, that is, God will do away with the old sacrificial offering and that He will reach out to the “nations” with a new system observing a “grain offering that is pure” and even including “incense” which will be accomplished “daily”  from “the rising of the sun even to its setting” and is a practice which is done as a perpetual “sacrificial” offering in many places and not just in a single building.

But this interpretation will instantly gain us an accusation that Catholics re-sacrifice Christ.

However, such an accusation digs the accusers own grave. If such sacrifices happen in a rebuilt temple, isn’t killing animals and shedding their blood also symbolic of re-sacrificing Christ?

How then do these justify their own claim where Jews will be re-sacrificing the Messiah via animal sacrifices? Can one degrade Christ’s blood to be as low as an animal? The Catholic and the Orthodox would cry out BLASPHEMY!.

The Messiah had already come! How can He be re-sacrificed?

So which is it? Are the Catholics re-sacrificing Christ or are the anti-Catholics simply re-sacrificing Christ with animals and misinterpreting Scripture? God no longer dwells in temples made by the hands of men. How could communion, this “daily sacrifice” be a metaphor, while Israel, so they say, will re-institute temple sacrifices with a literal application and from an old covenant perspective?

But to answer this dilemma, the naysayers will argue that while Israel will rebuild the temple, which Antichrist enters to stop the animal sacrifices, that such sacrifices are by no means acceptable to God. It is just that Ezekiel predicts what will happen as prophecy, thats all.

Really? In order to answer this question, we must first understand what is meant by “the Temple of God”. It is here were the reader will understand the limited scope he has in understanding God’s grand plan. When it comes to God’s plan, God is not interested in a building, but a mega operation that encompasses heaven with earth.

WHAT IS THE TEMPLE OF GOD
The Temple with both its spiritual and tangible substance is built on the foundation of Christ as described in Ephesians 2:19–22 which its citizens are ‘saints’ its foundations are ‘prophets’ with Christ as ‘chief corner stone’, a temple ‘fitly framed together’:

“Ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints, and of the household of God: And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone [of this Temple]; In whom all the building [of this Temple] fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the [Holy] Spirit.” (Ephesians 2:19–22)

This is no building structure. This is an amazing corporation, a partnership between heaven and earth as “fellow citizens” and “with the saints” in heaven with a “foundation of the apostles and prophets” and with “Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone” which all this is the “holy temple”.

So why make Ezekiel’s temple to simply be a literal building with animal sacrifices?

It is because all who follow the spirit of Antichrist, they only want to denounce the Catholic and the Orthodox priesthood. Such grasshoppers reject the very Temple of God, its authority, its hierarchy and the corporate responsibility.

This is why the grasshopper insists that Ezekiel’s Temple is simply a prophecy about the Jews re-instituting the sacrificial system. If so, how does the anti-Catholic justify his own argument that animal sacrifices are unnecessary?

But to answer this, they state that it is simply the Jews who are confused about Christ’s sacrifice and that the Bible simply prophesies the re-institution of the old sacrificial system, and not that God approves of it.

If such a flimsy answer is true, why would God Himself then support these very sacrifices:

“where the priests that approach unto the LORD shall eat the most holy things” (Ezekiel 42:13)

They “shall eat the most holy things”. God calls these sacrifices “holy” and acceptable. This alone debunks such arguments.

What holy things? Here they are:

“there shall they lay the most holy things, and the meat offering, and the sin offering, and the trespass offering; for the place is holy.”

Again, God approves of this sacrificial system. So what is this “meat offering” and this “sin offering” and this “trespass offering”?

God addresses “meat” and “grain” as if the two are the same sacrificial substance. The only interpretation is to heed to Christ when He broke the bread while stating : “For my flesh [meat offering] is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed” (John 6:55). This is a perpetual sacrifice:

“For as often as you shall eat this bread and drink the chalice, you shall shew the death of the Lord, until he come.” (1 Corinthians 11:26)

To “shew the death of the Lord” is an everlasting perpetual sacrifice. This “showing” is not done once but “as often as you shall eat this bread and drink the chalice” which reveals His death for us. This “chalice” and this “bread” is  tangible substance that represents a spiritual meaning.

Divorcing the tangible from the spiritual is the crux of the whole issue of Antichrist which is done in order to deny that “Christ came in the flesh”.

On a side note, combining the meat with grain is tradition which stems from ancient Judaism. Traditional Christians of the east, from Armenians to Roman Orthodox including even Muslims from Saudi Arabia to the Holy Land practiced the custom of combining lamb’s meat with grain called Harrisah or Jarish as an offering for the souls of the departed. Our family used to cook this on a fire pit in a huge copper pot while Christians had their patriarch make a blessing over the meal. Such practices were a reminder of God’s offering which many are too blind to see where even the name Bethlehem where Lehem is both meat and bread. Indeed, that village was the house of the Bread of Life and was also the house of the Lamb of God, both in one.

Once we understand the tangible substance that represents a spiritual meaning it all fits. One cannot ignore the tangible:

 “When the priests enter therein, then shall they not go out of the holy place into the outer court, but there they shall lay their garments wherein they minister; for they are holy; and shall put on other garments, and shall approach to those things which are for the people.”

These are literal garments (tangible substance) which represent a “spiritual meaning”.

God Himself even supports not just this sacrificial system mentioned in Ezekiel, but the carving of images (icons) and of vestments and garments just as Catholic and Orthodox priests do:

In the space above the outside of the entrance to the inner sanctuary and on the walls at regular intervals all around the inner and outer sanctuary were carved cherubim and palm trees. Palm trees alternated with cherubim. Each cherub had two facesthe face of a human being toward the palm tree on one side and the face of a lion toward the palm tree on the other. They were carved all around the whole temple. From the floor to the area above the entrance, cherubim and palm trees were carved on the wall of the main hall. (Ezekiel 41:17-20)

If this temple had carved statues of angels and even human beings, why then does the grasshopper hate icons? When it says in Ezekiel: “but there they shall lay their garments wherein they minister” is this tangible or symbolic of things spiritual?

It is both.

If this was only symbolic, why then aren’t these ‘sacrifices’ and ‘offerings’ also symbolic? Christian priests use their vestments only when they are officiating. These follow scripture to the letter. And if one claims this is a literal temple built by human hands and they hate carved statues, they must also hate Ezekiel’s temple.

God demanded “vestments” and not Hawaiian shirts and jeans. Vestments are liturgical clothing worn by Popes, Cardinals, Bishops, Priests, Deacons and other clergy in orthodoxy which follows Scripture to the letter, adhering to a hierarchy, indeed, a Temple which is built on the foundation of Christ as described in Ephesians 2:19–22 which its citizens are ‘saints’ its foundations are ‘prophets’ with Christ as ‘chief corner stone’ working in corporation as a unit.

So when we read the word “temple” one needs to decide, which meaning do we choose, a rich meaning fitting for God or a simple meaning fitting to a cult in Jerusalem called the Temple Institute who adhere to things prior of the “greater things to come”?

This is no simple building. This temple unites earthly saints to heavenly Jerusalem, where angels and heavenly saints reside with Christ, the “chief corner stone”.

All this is not simple to comprehend.

Therefore, to re-interpret Ezekiel’s temple as a Jewish sacrificial system would be an interpretation of an Antichrist, for Islam still continues animal sacrifices which God abhors. Islam has Judaising elements in its religion. Antichrist will abolish the “daily sacrifice” which is exactly what anti-Catholics call to do, for their “grain offering” is no sacrifice. It is a gnostic sacrifice for it simply becomes grain without the substance of Christ. If God resided in an Ark why can’t Christ also reside in His Communion bread? You can easily believe that electricians can have energy reside in a central location and such energy is distributed to your light socket, why can’t you believe that God can also be omnipresent in a way that He too can reside in Eucharists?

People need to think. Antichrist would not mind abolishing all sacraments. He would make the sacrament of marriage a non-sacrament and divorce a minor sin so that every Tom would marry Harry’s wife and every Dick marries both; Tom’s and Harry’s ex-wives. This would be closer to Islam not Christianity where marriage is portrayed between husband and wife as Christ and His Church. This is a corporate relationship which only the true faith has.

Antichrist would not mind abolishing the sacrament of confession. He will re-interpret the confession of the disciples to one another to mean the reverse opposite so when Jesus “breathed on them and said, ‘Receive the Holy Spirit’ If you forgive anyone’s sins, their sins are forgiven” to mean the opposite of what it simply says.

Seriously, what other interpretation is there for “If you forgive anyone’s sins, their sins are forgiven”?

Therefore, in the New Testament, the sinner would have to confesses to one of these twelve priests (disciples) in order to get their sins “forgiven”.

Does that need a rocket scientist to interpret? A child can easily read this to see what it means. What we have here, in the primitive church, are twelve priests listening to confessions and forgiving the sins of the people. And so how can one forgive a sin of another if the other does not disclose this sin? Would this not be confession as in “confess your sins to one another” (James 5:16)?

Better yet, how can the disciples forgive sins? Where the disciples gods? Is it not only God Who can forgive sins?

But Jesus used this same example to such priestly authority:

“I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are sons of the Most High” (Psalm 82:6).

“Gods” and “sons of the Most High”?

Even Christ confirms it in John 10:34–36: “Is it not written in your law, ‘I said, “You are gods”? 

It is here where the devil enters and confuses. Unless one understands the meaning of ‘Temple’ from a new testament perspective they would not get it. It is the temple of Ephesians 2:19–22, an entire hierarchy with heaven above meeting earth below in this heavenly mount Zion where the Church cooperates with heaven above.

The process of achieving this is completely missing in today’s Protestant systematic theology, forgetting that God wants to mold us into perfection where we reflect and cooperate in God’s plan in a corporate wayIt is called Corporate Responsibility which completely stems from the Bible. It is the concept of one for all and all for one. This is a theme that is well etched from Genesis to Revelation. For example:

“Just as sin entered the world through one man, death through sin entered all men” (Romans 5:12).

This one man is Adam. So from Genesis we see this. Adam caused all the damage for the corporate others to suffer and it is one man (the new Adam, Christ) who does the fix for all the corporate others to heal.

This is indeed, the crux of the whole Christian theology.

Just as sin entered through one man in Romans 5, the redemption thereof is through one man:

“God made him [Christ, single seed] who had no sin to be sin for us [plural seeds], so that in him [one man] we [all of us, plural] might become the righteousness of God” (2 Corinthians 5:21).

Corporate Responsibility is how scripture is fulfilled. When it comes to Christ or His mother, the relationship with their seed is corporate, as if between the saints and the King. Corporate Responsibility uses the common old maxim derived from Matthew 25, that a blessing or an attack on one of the king’s officers (the saints) is an attack on the king himself (God). This principle is so clear when Christ in Matthew 25:40 says:

“Since you have done it unto one of the least of these [plural] my brethren [the King’s soldiers], you have done it unto me [the King]”.

This is the Temple of God. An attack on a saint is an attack on the King of Kings Himself and His Temple.

This verse is only explained and completely understood in the apostolic succession theology and without this, the scoffers, the grasshoppers would always quote only parts of the biblical texts arguing over Mary, the Saints, Confession to a priest, the Eucharist … it never ends.

They will keep doing this till kingdom come until they are arrested by Christ as chaff and thrown into the dungeon burning with fire and brimstone while the wise virgins who comprehend enter the barn with their Bridegroom.

The grasshopper can never comprehend Théōsis. This can never be unless the Christian continually partakes of Christ’s literal body through communion and continually confessing their sins before they do this: 

“if we confess our sins [continually], he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness” (1 John 1:9).

Without confession to Christ, that is, to the corporate body of Christ, His Temple, to His heavenly Mount Zion, there is no remission of sin.

Yet the spirit of Antichrist has his demonic disciples, the grasshoppers and the locusts, repeat a question: how could anyone “forgive sins” since Jesus is “the only mediator” and “intercessor”?

But this is not a Jesus-style question. In ancient Israel, the prophet was the mediator between Man and God as he cooperates with God. Moses begged God to show mercy unto the children of Israel as they were worshipping the golden calf. He was a mediator. The people exhorted Samuel to “Pray for thy servants to the Lord thy God, that we may not die, for we have added to all our sins this evil, to ask for a king.” (1 Samuel 12:19)

However, the grasshopper will answer that these were types of Christ, that when Christ came, it was He alone Who could forgive sins.

However, the people of Judea and Jerusalem flocked to St. John the Baptist, “confessing their sins.” (Mark 1:5) And again, Jesus Himself told the Disciples that “Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained.” (John 20:23)

And then we have St. Paul’s letter to the Corinthians. Even St. Paul spoke of confessing to a priest:

“And to whom you [the priest] have pardoned any thing, I also. For, what I [as a priest] have pardoned, if I have pardoned any thing, for your sakes have I done it in the person of Christ.” (2 Corinthians 2:10)

What part of “I have done it [forgiving sins] in the person of Christ” do you, the grasshopper, not understand?

This is Christ’s Temple.

And even amongst the grasshoppers, the pastor who believes in no sacraments, while he stomps on the Altar with his shoes dressed up in Hawaiian shirt and jeans, he is allowed to become an intercessory agent between the sinner and Christ and he is accepted to do “intercessory prayers” for his flock.

Is this not intercession?

If aiding or abusing Christ’s “brethren,” Christ says “you have done it unto me” then forgiving sin is also “done it in the person of Christ.” (2 Corinthians 2:10). So when we read “temple” we must not view these words in tunnel vision for language is limited. Christ residing in His Temple and Christ forgiving, is magnificent, complex, mysterious, miraculous, corporate and is un-comprehendable to man for the things of heaven are never fully comprehended by man that an eye can see while the spirit cannot be understood by human faculties.

The things of the spirit are not mere wind, but substance of unfathomable things. How can one fully and truly explain “He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.” How can I, the weak man explain “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me”? If this “me” (Christ) involves hurting or contributing to a saint it is because this “me” involves the corporate Temple of God.

This leads us to the grasshoppers. What do we make of them?

THE GNOSTIC CHRISTIAN
It is in fact the gnostic who rejects all this. Why? He believes that the blood of Christ, vestments, carved images, incense, Eucharist …  are abstract, intangible thought, idea or teaching.

Again, the conflict between Christians and grasshoppers is the conflict between the tangible and the abstract. To believe in the abstract while ignoring the tangible is the crux of the whole issue of Christianity.

This is why in every dialogue between Christian and grasshopper, that whenever you quote verses with the tangible, they will always counter with the spiritual.

But grasshoppers do not follow scripture despite them saying that they do.

They don’t. So where did all this limited and selective interpretation of God’s Word stem from?

It stems from the doctrines of men whom they do not even know or have ever read about. No reader of history can write about Protestantism without writing, at least briefly, on the pre-Reformation heretics. Catharism “the pure ones” was a Christian dualist or Gnostic revival movement that thrived in some areas of Southern Europe, particularly northern Italy and southern France between the 12th and 14th centuries. The followers were known as Cathars and are now mainly remembered for a prolonged period of persecution by the Catholic church which did not recognise their belief as truly Christian. The Cathars actually became the grasshoppers martyrs. You can read all about these here.

But how can these be ‘martyrs’ especially after studying what is rarely discussed. What one will find in this history, is that the roots of Protestantism is gnosticism from the Cathars, or the belief that Christ was not physical, but a phantom.

To reject the physical Humanity of Christ, would then lead to the rejection of the main sacraments, the Eucharist, Confession, icons and holy water which all these were clearly defined in scripture.

The devil by having his apostolates ignore the tangible parts of scripture it resulted in agnosticism. When perusing their history, one will find that these pre-Reformation sects rejected crucifixes, icons, Confession and the Eucharist.

In other words, they rejected the tangible.

In fact, the gnostic rejection of the Eucharist stems much back further. While so many of these grasshoppers reject Muhammad the Muslim Arab, they do not realize that their system of belief stems from another Arab: Scythianus

In fact Scythianus was first mentioned by a student of the Apostles, Ignatius of Antioch. St. John the apostle himself debated the gnostic Scythianus, the Arab, thoroughly defeating him (see Epiphanius of Salamis). Scythianus taught the dualistic doctrine of the two principles. He was influenced — as we learn from the Church historian Socrates — by the teachings of Pythagoras, Empedocles and the paganism of Egypt.  

Islam picked up from such gnosticism claiming that the Crucifixion was an illusion which led to the grasshopper’s denial of the Eucharist. Ignatius of Antioch, a direct student of the Apostles themselves, in his letter to the Smyrnaeans stated:   

“Take note of those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ which has come to us, and see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God… They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer, because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the Flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, Flesh which suffered for our sins and which the Father, in his goodness, raised up again. They who deny the gift of God are perishing in their disputes.” (Letter to the Smyrnaeans, Ch 6)

All this led to the rejection of holy icons or the Eucharist. Such rejection did not come from the Apostles, or even the Scriptures, which speak of carved images, but from gnosticism itself and is why the unorthodox, like the Muslims, reject having images while it was clear in ancient Israel, images were on the Ark and is mentioned in Ezekiel’s Temple as we stated (see Ezekiel 41:17-20).

But no matter how many times one argues with the grasshopper, it is unable to chew on the word of God for it is a grasshopper, it only chews on leaves and little booklets where it adheres to pre-formed quick and dirty leaflets that speak on how to obtain a quick and instantaneous salvation.

But in reality what these sell is Gnosticism which treats physical matter as evil, and thus any physical sacraments, such as the Eucharist, or any icons, would be rejected on account of their being physical. 

Bulgarian scholar Georgi Vasilev in his Heresy and the English Reformation shed significant light on this history which trickled all the way to the pre-Reformation sects: Wycliff and Tyndale.

Since the 12th century, favor towards dualist and Cathar heresy had been growing, from the Lollards all the way to the poetry of Milton. It was not the solid Bible that was the basis of the reformation, but the pre-Reformation dualists in England who were that real quicksand foundation. The Lollards, who were zealous followers of Wycliffe who “maintained that Lucifer and his associates were condemned unjustly” (see Moreri, A New and General Biographical Dictionary, Lollard). 

Lucifer was condemned unjustly?

According to scholar F. Litchenberger, the Lollards had a prophecy that “Lucifer and the demons unfairly chased away from Heaven will some day be restored there.”(1) The Lollards were therefore satanists; devil worshippers who made Lucifer into their god and the true God into a demon. Wycliffe, the main martyr of the grasshoppers also taught a form of pantheism, that anyone or any creature can become God:

“Every person is God. Every creature is God. Every being is everywhere, since every being is God.”

Its satan’s old lie “I am God” which is represented in Isaiah 14. This is the spirit of Antichrist.

It was from the Cathars that John Wycliffe and Tyndale, who continued the gnostic teaching, rejected the Eucharist:

“That the essence of material bread and wine remains [the same] after their consecration at the altar.” (2)

Tyndale taught the same heresy, saying:

“Now the testament is, that is his blood was shed for our sins; but is impossible that the cup or his blood should be that promise”. (3)  

Tyndale held that the Blood of the New Covenant that Christ spoke of in the Last Supper was simply referring to the teachings of the Bible, and this same belief was taught by the Cathar Bogomils, for as Zigabenus says of them: “The ‘new wine’ they say is their teaching.” (4) When Christ said, “my blood is real drink” (John 6:55), the gnostic rejects this, and believes that the blood of Christ is an abstract, intangible thought, idea or teaching.

It is for this reason that when one peruses Protestant interpretations that one finds an array of opposing views and is why they have so many un-united sects and denominations.

Again, the spirit of Antichrist started the conflict between the tangible and the abstract.

While the priest in old Israel acted as an intercessor between Man and God, the priest of the New Covenant acts as a participant in the mediation of Christ. St. Paul said that there is “one mediator of God and men, the man Christ Jesus” (1 Timothy 2:5). But this truth cannot isolate man from participating in the mediation of Christ.

t is actually here where the grasshopper who insists on a ‘personal relationship’ errs in isolating the Christian from His Christ.

If abusing Christ’s saints or aiding them becomes a corporate issue within His Temple: “you have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, you have done it unto me” then forgiving sin is just as corporate: “And to whom you [the priest] have pardoned any thing, I also. For, what I [as a priest] have pardoned, if I have pardoned any thing, for your sakes have I done it in the person of Christ.” (2 Corinthians 2:10)

Do you see this “I have done it in the person of Christ“?

So if aiding Christians is done in the person of Christ forgiving sinners is also done in the person of Christ.

Nothing can be more ‘personal’ in this relationship with Christ than this.

Once a true Christian understands this concept, then Scripture becomes a breeze to comprehend as far as our limited capacity can understand the matters of God and His Temple.

The grasshopper, by redefining Christ’s mediation as something abstract, without it ever being conduced in any incarnational manner or personal, portraying it as only man directly asking God for forgiveness, in which there is no human authority confirming absolution, this becomes the sort of teaching that Islam has. This is not Christianity. This is Antichrist.

It is obvious once we examine the verses inductively that God, indeed, established a Temple, in which man may participate as a priest, as the mediator between Man and God, as a partaker in the mediation of Christ, in the place of Christ on earth, exactly as the New Covenant mandated.

In fact, history reveals that it was the heretical Cathars and the Lollards and later the Protestant sects who rejected the Sacrament of Reconciliation.

But how can a true Christian have anything in common with Cathars? In the 15th century it was declared in the Norwich heresy trial records that a certain Lollard leader, named Margaret, said: 

“confession is made only before God and no other priest.”(5)

Tyndale, the heretic, also rejected the Sacrament of Confession, preaching against the idea of a priest being “a mediator between God and us.” (6)  Tyndale taught really a theological socialism, where there is no hierarchy, and all peoples, “every man and woman that know Christ and his doctrine” have the sacrament “to bind and loose”. (7)

The bulk majority of anti-Catholic grasshoppers are in fact oblivious to the teachings of Wycliffe, their martyr church father. Wycliffe himself was gnostic. While these grasshoppers accuse Catholics of having seven additional apocryphal books, they do not know that their gnostic martyr, Tyndale, actually approved and translated the gnostic book, the Gospel of Nicodemus (the Evangelium Nicodemi), one of the numerous gnostic gospels that were completely rejected by the Church. The Lollard sect had eventually evolved into the Puritan cult of England. As A.F. Thomson notes:

“by the time that the Roman establishment was succeeded by the Anglican, the Lollardy was developing into Puritanism.” (8)

Even Martin Luther who for centuries has been touted as a champion for Biblical Christianity, the claiming reformer who was to bring the Church back to its original roots and eschew the “traditions of men” has been exposed by recent scholarship. Based on perusing notes written by the German reformer it reveals a gnostic Luther who was adversed to the orthodox view of the Trinity, the Humanity of Christ, and Augustine’s refutations of gnosticism with sentiments more in favor towards the Manichaean heresy than orthodoxy. While it is true that Luther wrote many true statements on Christ — that would be anti-gnostic — such as that Christ is “that holy ladder by which we ascend to the knowledge of God,” (9) we cannot ignore what has been discovered in literally what comprised to be thousands of notes written by Luther himself on the margins of books written by reputed theologians such as Augustine and Peter Lombard whom Luther criticized revealing he was truly a Manichean heretic of the first order.

The whole data was much overlooked until the 20th century when the German scholar Theobald Beer enduringly read through the notes, studying the patriarch of Protestantism for thirty five years. Beer’s research on Luther was eventually published in his 1980, 584 page publication, Der fröhliche Wechsel und Streit, in which he exposed and discoursed on the heretical gnostic beliefs and teachings of Luther. In fact, even Melanchthon, the closest colleague of Luther and one of the head figures of the Protestant Reformation, criticized the German reformer as having  “Manichean delirium”.

And just in case one wants to argue the typical ‘Luther’s old age senile’ argument, the notes were written within the time periods of 1506 to 1516, and 1535 to 1545. Luther was born 1483 and died on 18 February 1546. In 1506 he was 23 at the prime of his life to 1516, he would have been 33. And from 1535 to 1545 would make Luther between 52 and 62 years of age. This is hardly a senile.

And lest we undermine Manichaeanism, the central belief of Manichaeanism is that there are two principles — one good and one evil — existing co-eternally, and eternally opposing each other. The evil principle — Satan — created humanity, and thus humanity unto itself is evil; and the good principle — the god of Mani — created the spiritual world. This doctrine places humanity and God not in an intimate relationship, but rather sets them up in war against each other.

By making God co-eternal with the devil, it places Satan’s power at an equal level with God’s. It is reminiscent to the Mormons — who are just modern day gnostics — when they say that Christ is the brother of Lucifer; the teaching makes Christ just another son of God, and Lucifer as also another son of God. The doctrine enables a high esteem for Satan, and a decayed view on God, and in numerous cases open devil worship. Hilaire Belloc wrote that gnosticism “bred all sorts of secondary effects. In some men it would lead to devil worship” (Belloc, The Great Heresies, p. 72).

One of these men influenced by all this was Luther. This gnostic precept, and its decayed and diabolical hermeneutics, is seen in Luther’s own words: 

“the devil must be granted an hour of divinity and I must attribute fiendishness to God” (30 Days, No. 2, 1992, “Luther: Manichaean Delierium” by Antonio Socci and Tommaso Ricci, pg. 55)

Luther, in his glosses, did not affirm that Christ was murdered on account of humanity’s sin — which is in accordance to orthodox doctrine — but that Christ was guilty of sin Himself. As we read from the quote just presented, Luther believed that Christ submitted to the devil.

For Luther, there is no reconciliation between humanity and divinity, since the former is too evil to be worthy of union with the latter. Luther held that Christ was a compound nature. Instead of saying that Christ is a person, He called the Holy One a compositum. Even Luther’s disciple, Melanchthon, tried to correct such errors after Luther’s death, saying: “The formulas to be rejected are: ‘Christ is composed of two natures’ and ‘Christ is the fruit of creation.’”

Christ is one, both very God and very Man, without any of these two natures mingling together or mixing, but remaining the same unchangingly. Luther on the other hand believed that Christ composed of both divinity and the diabolical, because humanity unto itself, according to Luther, is evil and of the devil. Hence, Luther said that Lucifer “must be granted an hour of divinity”, with Christ — in His sinful Humanity — submitting to Satan in guilt of its sin. Since humanity is evil, then Christ’s humanity is evil, and thus the Word of the Father, Christ Himself, became evil.

And since according to Luther, humanity is evil, then his works mean nothing, even if they are righteous. This is why today, the grasshopper is quick to quote a verse saying that their works are but “filthy rags”. This is a devil’s interpretation of Isaiah 64 which in context states:

“But when we continued to sin against them, you were angry. How then can we be saved? All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away. Your sacred cities have become a desert; even Zion is a desert, Jerusalem a desolation.” 

This speaks of Israel sinning against God without repentance and return to the former state. It is only then that God abandoned them where Jerusalem and its Temple were destroyed and calls their works as “filthy rags”. This by no means says that the works of righteousness are ‘filthy rags’?

But such demonic interpretations stem from the gnostic hatred for humanity. Since humanity is evil, then his works mean nothing, even if they are righteous. Luther wrote that when Christ died on the Cross, “the devil had free access to Christ, and the divinity had withdrawn its power and left the humanity to fight alone.” (10)

Such were the “doctrines of demons”. Luther held that it was the Divinity of Christ that saves us, but not His Humanity, writing: “Christ works for our salvation, but without the cooperation of human nature.”

This goes along with the gnostic view, that humanity is evil and therefore the Humanity of Christ must also be rendered useless in the redemption of mankind. Paralleling this view, the Albigensian gnostics of southern France taught that the Christ of the Gospels was evil.

 This was the warped theology of Luther which is why the grasshopper is pesky and difficult completely rejecting “the daily” “grain” sacrificial offering.

This is why the un-repentant grasshopper will stand with Antichrist.

ANTICHRIST IS THE KINGDOM OF THE GRASSHOPPERS DESECRATING THE TEMPLE
Think about it, Erdogan said “All the leaders of the EU countries went to the Vatican and listened to the pope submissively.”

The grasshopper should fully agree. Who amongst the kingdom of the grasshoppers would after all want to obey the Vatican or the EU which many grasshoppers deem the Vatican and the E.U. as the very kingdom of Antichrist.

The grasshopper therefore should then agree with Erdogan, his king, despite his hatred of him.

He sees the Temple Institute in Jerusalem and he is convinced that God’s hand is in it, while forgetting that the devil will always attempt to fulfill his interpretation of prophecy as genuine. This is why it takes a corporate Temple to decipher the good, the bad from the plain ugly.

So when the king of the grasshoppers, Erdogan says: “The situation is quite loud and clear, it is a Crusader Alliance. April 16 will also be the day to evaluate this,” the kingdom of the grasshoppers should agree for they too hate the Crusaders.

But the scriptures spoke of the kingdom of the grasshoppers in John’s Apocalypse as well as in Joel. Grasshoppers want to destroy by conversion mainly “those men who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads” (Revelation 9:4).

In Daniel 9, in the strictest sense also in Ezekiel, makes it so clear that if these sacrifices are strictly “memorial” as the grasshopper claims, to only be “do this in remembrance of Me” why then it is a “sin offering”?

The grasshopper has no leaves left to chew.

But the Grasshopper would reply like a broken record ‘its the re-institution of Jewish temple sacrifices’.

No grasshopper. It is the perpetual sacrifice.

The grasshopper will then agree when Antichrist carries out his abomination of desolation:

“And it was magnified even to the prince of the strength: and it took away from him the continual sacrifice, and cast down the place of his sanctuary”.

Indeed, in the grasshopper’s theology “casts down the place of his sanctuary”. It makes the sacrificial altar an ‘altar’ under his feet. He rejected the ‘continual sacrifice’. Why? John tells us exactly why:

“And strength was given him against the continual sacrifice, because of sins: and truth shall be cast down on the ground, and he shall do and shall prosper.”

“Because of sins”, the “Perpetual Sacrifice” is no more and orthodoxy is rejected: “truth shall be cast down” and heresy instead is consumed by the grasshopper who prospers and spreads his heresy spiritually killing the ones without the mark of God. He “prospers” in converting the unworthy to becoming grasshoppers like him. These unworthy are without true foundation and without the Eucharist. In fact, the grasshopper split from heaven itself:

“And it was magnified even unto the strength of heaven: and it threw down of the strength, and of the stars, and trod upon them.”

This “strength of heaven,” the power of the Holy Spirit, and “the stars” are the angelic host of Mount Zion. The grasshopper “threw down the strength” the very power of God having the form of godliness yet denying the power of Christ in converting the Bread into His Body. Such “strength” and “power” is the goal of the Christian to come to God through his continual access and a lifetime supplication to connect to God’s Temple, the Heavenly Mount Zion. In other words, these locusts sever the link between earth and heaven. But it is this “strength of heaven” which is the connect between the saint and heavenly mount Zion:

“But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angelsto the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are registered in heaven, to God the Judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect [saints]to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel.” (Hebrews 12:22-24)

This is the whole goal and process of salvation, that is, to transform us striving to become “the righteous” who are “made perfect” by “the blood of sprinkling” the Eucharist and the Wine, the Flesh and the Blood of Christ and our prayers to saints. This is the communion between the Church Militant on earth and the Church Triumphant in heavenly Mount Zion, where the saints, angels and The Trinity reside. The grasshopper desecrates this magnifying himself even unto the strength of heaven: and he threw down of the strength, and of the stars, and trod upon them…

The strive of the Christian is to be in God’s Temple, the heavenly Jerusalem which the grasshopper desecrates and stomps underfoot rendering all of it useless. And by this he believes he is with Christ when in reality he stands with Antichrist and is why Christ will tell the grasshopper “I never knew you” despite all the claims of heeling, casting demons, and all the signs and the wonders for he came out of the pit and the smoke and he will go back into the pit.

CHRISTIANS ARE BEING KILLED AND RAPED EVERY SINGLE DAY, PLEASE CLICK HERE TO MAKE A DONATION TO OUR RESCUE TEAM THAT WILL SAVE THE LIVES OF CHRISTIANS FROM PERSECUTION

 REFERENCES

(1) Encyclopedie des sciences religieuses, publ. sous la direction de F. Lichtenberger, vol. 8 (Paris: 1880, p. 347, in Vasilev, Heresy and the English Reformation, ch. 1, p. 15 

(2) XXIV Conslusiones Wycclyf damnatae Londoniis in synodo, Fasculi Zizianorum, p. 278, in Vasilev, Heresy and the English Reformation, ch. 4, p. 65

(3) Tyndale, Doctrinal Treatises, p. 379, in Vasilev, Heresy and the English Reformation, ch. 5, p. 90

(4) See Vasilev, Heresy and the English Reformation, ch. 5, p. 90

(5) N. Tanner, ed., Kent Heresy Proceedings 1511-12 (Kent Archeological Society: 1997), p. 2, in Vasilev, Heresy and the English Reformation, ch. 5, p. 87

(6) Tyndale, Obedience, p. 111, in Vasilev, Heresy and the Protestant Reformation, ch. 5, p. 87

(7) W. Tyndale, Practice of Prelates, p. 284, in Vasilev, Heresy and the English Reformation, ch. 5, p. 89

(8) Thomson, The Later Lollards, p. 253, in Vasilev, Heresy and the English Reformation, ch.1, p. 30

(9) Quoted by K.A. Hagen, A Theology of Testament in the Young Luther, p. 92

(10) WA 45.239, 32-40, quoted in the Oxford Handbook of Martin Luther’s Theology, P. 280

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  • PaulF

    Brilliant article.
    The Incarnation/Eucharist is at the heart of our faith, and every heresy there ever was is a futile attempt to pretend it didn’t happen.

    • Raph Sebastian

      Amen!

    • Kamau41

      Indeed, Paul. AMEN!!

      • 41, whatever happened to Superman? Is he too fasting from Falafel and Rowing the ship?

        • Kamau41

          I’m not sure. I will send him an email to find out.

          • Thank you 41. While you and Grand and Trevor went to fast, Superman wandered with his multi-colored cape.

    • Yes Paul. Now from prophecy, we know why “The Incarnation/Eucharist is at the heart of our faith”. I spent years as an Evangelical trying to decipher this and other things, but did not realize that the only way to decipher all this was to consume the Eucharist.

  • The Hagia Sophia is to be re-converted to a mosque and it is reported Erdogan plan to pray there on Good Friday, a middle finger to all Orthodox Christians.

    There is one temple that continues to stand to this day – the Vatican. I fear there isn’t a leader like Pope Pius V who helped lead a Holy League that defeated the Ottoman naval forces and saved Western Europe from the scourges of the Ottoman Empire.

    The Eucharist is the only sacrifice that remains to be taken away from the believers, bishops will be slaughter wholesale with priests and that’s why Joel predicts priests who remains will weep and mourn because without the authority and presence of their bishops, they cannot consecrate the Eucharist.

    God bless, Constantine.

    • Aha. I knew how to get this guy out of his slumber. It took 8000 words on his favorite subject. I love it when a plan comes together.

      Please read my response to Alexander which deals with the issue you brought up. It could be Vatican.

      • Kamau41

        Told you he was coming back. The plan came together and it worked!

        • Yes. He just clocked in and he’s back to work on the deck. You follow him with that soap bucket and tooth brushes. On the double 😉

          • Gladly. Now hand me that bucket and the toothbrush. Oh dear, it’s not electric I guess old fashion way will do it.

            😉

          • Kamau41

            Don’t worry, doing it the old fashion way will help you to be effective of getting the job done just as fast!

          • Man, this deck has been neglected. Bird droppings everywhere. What’s this? Vomit from heretics? Lord have mercy upon me, a sinner!

            I just worn out this toothbrush, here’s another one.

          • “Bird droppings everywhere. ”

            Make sure you use your toothbrush. It all looks like toothpaste anyway.

          • David W

            Some grasshoppers have passed thru too…

          • Ya. I sent 41 an instruction video on how we expect the job to be done. We live to serve this ship.

          • Kamau41

            Lol; trust me, he’s already waaaaaaay ahead doing his duties.

          • Grandmere

            I was wondering if he could hold off for forty days. Keeping silence is hard. I’m glad he’s back.

          • Yes. He finished his 40 days time of testing with the Almighty. And now he has to endure 40 more days testing from me 😉

          • Kamau41

            He will endure it just fine Chef! He will be doubly refined.

          • Kamau41

            Right! keeping silence is very difficult these days.

          • Ozibarb

            me too. I missed you both.

      • I could not sit still and be silent any longer.

        Your response to Alexander regarding the temple is good. There are Apostolic Christians resides in Jerusalem and soon, the Orthodox will be celebrating the Holy Fire which occurs every year in Jerusalem.

        It is possible the Antichrist enters multiple holy places and desecrates there. By having bishops murdered, it becomes difficult for priests to be conscreated to bishop without having 3 bishops present. Then if priests are murdered, deacons are next and so on.

        No wonder Joel speaks of priests mourning and calling for an assembly to fast and mourn, to plead to God to intervene lest His name be profaned.

        Catholics, Orthodox, Coptics, and Anglicans all believe the Eucharist is the Real Presence of Christ and to take it away is to take away our spiritual food which we are nourished, as St. Ignatius says.

        On a more personal note, I do beg your forgiveness for offenses I have committed to you since it’s still Lent and Holy Week is next week. I look forward to doing my first confession and will be confirmed as an Anglo-Catholic in August, God willing.

        • You have done me no harms Trevor. It was I who kept bossing you around to clean this ship 😉 so please forgive.

          • I’m enjoying this. The sun is on my back, the sweats and a few cuss words here and there and the gentle breeze makes doing penance wonderful.

          • When you and Grand went on this long fast I had wondered what happened to you all. I had no one to nag at except poor 41. So tell me how was the fast?

          • Hard. It was hard to stay off this site because of some stunning development that took place, such as Erdogan threatening “holy war” upon Europe which I wrote a blog post and sent it to Theodore.

            http://atrevorsjournal.blogspot.com/2017/03/stunning-turkey-threatens-holy-war-upon.html

          • “It was hard to stay off this site”

            Don’t forget to scrub the lower deck 😉

          • You got it.

    • Kamau41

      Absolutely Trevor…. So great to see you back rowing with me my brother.

      • He’s not going to be rowing 41. He will be cleaning the deck. With a tooth brush while you two talk about shrimping:

    • The Greeks are nervous about the April 16 referendum and the Hagia Sophia is mentioned in this article.

      http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/greeks-too-are-apprehensive-of-april-16.aspx?PageID=238&NID=111521&NewsCatID=422

      • racarrera

        They have every reason to be. Things are about to get very interesting.

        • Reminds me of the saying, “May you live in interesting times.”

          -__-

    • Cuzick

      He’s Back ! Good to hear from you.

    • Filip

      Yeah and I’m just so sad that Orthodox Christians are… basically sleeping not realizing what is being done here by Erdogan.

      • I am sure they are aware of what’s going on and are powerless to do anything about it.

        Some are waiting for the prediction made by Elder St. Pasios where Russia finally defeats Turkey and liberates the Hagia Sophia, returning them to the Orthodox. Only time will tell.

        • racarrera

          We’re very much aware. Perhaps overly so. But we’re also used to it, and will remain Orthodox in defense of our faith.

          • I would expect nothing less from the beloved Orthodox.

          • Grandmere

            We have Orthodox who worship with us because they do not have a church nearby. It’s not in buildings. It’s in God’s people.

          • Amen, Grandmere.

            While it is the beginning of Holy Week, it has already been marred by the bombings of the Coptic Church in Egypt, including St. Mark where their pope was in attendance. Nobody knows the fate of him yet.

            It broke my heart when I read this morning on Twitter on what’s happening with the Coptic.

            They have suffered enough already…

            🙁

          • Grandmere

            I just got back from a packed out early service. A large crowd was assembling to process in for the second service. It could have been us. Maybe it will be one day.

          • I think one day it will happen on our shores. Just remember that 2 Esdras warned this would happen and that’s where Christ quoted Matthew 24 from.

            We need to be ready.

          • Grandmere

            We are like those fishermen we were talking about. We are in the storm and we have to give it our best shot. It’s too late to turn back. I just remember when the disciples were terrified and Jesus was sleeping. At the right time, he rose up and rebuked the waves.

          • Kkdgrace

            You are one wise woman, Grandmere!

          • Vinny Zee

            They have the buildings, we have the faith! – St. Athanasius

            “May God console you! What saddens you? Is the fact that others have occupied the churches by violence, while during this time you are on the outside? It is a fact that they have the premises – but you have the Apostolic Faith. They can occupy our churches, but they are outside the true Faith. You remain outside the places of worship, but the Faith dwells within you. Let us consider: what is more important, the place or the Faith? The true Faith, obviously. Who has lost and who has won in the struggle – the one who keeps the premises or the one who keeps the Faith? True, the premises are good when the Apostolic Faith is preached there; they are holy if everything takes place there in a holy way.”

          • Never seen this before. I love St. Anthansius. We need men like him today.

          • Kamau41

            We most certainly do for sure.

          • racarrera

            Pure wisdom, brother.

          • Kamau41

            Powerful house quote that is full of wisdom from the great St. Anthanasius. We so badly need men like him today!

          • Kkdgrace

            Wonderful! Thank you, Vinny.

          • What about me? Look at all the friends your making at my falafel stand. Isn’t it written that ‘blessed are the friends maker”?

            🙂

          • Kkdgrace

            Without a doubt! That’s something that “goes without saying”! Bless you sir and may you have a wonderful and blessed Pascha! You know how much your “peeps” love ya! If not, I’m here to declare “it is so”!
            🙂

          • Getting the Kkdgrace blessing beats the heck out of any Pulitzer Prize.

          • Kkdgrace

            Lol- now THAT was funny! Still laughing at your link! Thanks- I needed that! And what a truly lovely thing to say to me. Truly.

          • Kkdgrace

            I LOVE your falafel stand! My favorite hang out! Thanks for providing this place of refuge.

  • AnthonyM

    Love it, Walid. Will return to read more later today.

    • “Will return to read more later today.”

      After you do your rosary, of course.

      • AnthonyM

        Mission accomplished.

  • Ceirwyn

    I think both interpretations are likely true to varying degrees. This is, after all, satan’s all out assault on God’s children and His will on Earth. Satan will be happy to try to destroy communion, churches, Israel, Christians, and anything else he can convince someone to obliterate. If the cultists rebuild a temple, I have no doubt it will get defiled to, just to make a point if nothing else.

    As for communion, that’s going to be hard to stop, as long as wine and grain are available for sale. This doesn’t mean it won’t happen, just I don’t see a way for them to enforce it. If Christians start meeting in each other’s houses, it’s going to be even harder to stop, because who outside would realize its a church meeting and not a dinner party (all I can think of is Prohibition in US and what a failure it was)?It will be interesting to see how this develops.

    • “I think both interpretations are likely true to varying degrees. ”

      Indeed. Please see my response to Alexander.

    • Grandmere

      What if you have bread and wine – but no priest? What then?

      • Ceirwyn

        It would be hard for them to root out elders as well (elders are the Baptist equivalent of bishops). Unlike Catholic priests, they don’t usually dress differently from the congregation. The local church knows who they are but unless told, an outsider wouldn’t. It’s one of the perks of a less centralized system; almost everyone can get off the radar quickly.

        I also think some Catholics have started the home church bit to. It would very wise at this point for Catholic priests to establish some priests off the official records in the event they all end up dead, jailed, or banished.

        • Grandmere

          I never heard of elders in the Baptist church. I know they have deacons, but they are not ordained. They are laymen. It would be an absolute impossibility for such a person to consecrate bread and wine. As for our priests, we may have to reinstitute priest holes as during the reformation. There could not be an off the record priest. Never.

          • Ceirwyn

            Yet they have them. And they are ordained. They just don’t advertise their existence outside local congregations.

  • Cuzick

    “All the leaders of the EU countries went to the Vatican and listened to the pope submissively.” How many people will see this statement and use it as evidence to maintain their stand that Rome is antiChrist, the EU is the beast and the Crusades were evil because Islam is a religion of peace.
    But the wise man from Bethlehem refutes this ignorance with the true Biblical interpretation and the facts of history as one skilled in yielding the two edged sword of truth.
    The grasshoppers will break their teeth chewing on this one.

    By the way, A beautiful video at the end Mr Shoebat, could our Russian Orthodox brothers translate them in future so those of us who are “bi-lingual challenged ” can receive the fullest blessing in them? 😉

    • Стефан Евгений

      This is Schema-archimandrite Seraphim Bit Haribo. He is chanting the 50th Pslam in Aramaic. He said he is chanting this for the repentance for The Ukraine. He is Assyrian that may seem odd but the church in Georgia was under the See of Antioch for hundreds of years. His church is in Georgia, Mtskheta district, a village called Kandy.

      • Cuzick

        Thank you for the insight. See , your transitioning nicely as the official translator on the site.

        • Стефан Евгений

          No not on your life!!!!! I read very very slowly. Translation is an art form.

          • Cuzick

            Your contributions are greatly appreciated. I have learned very much by your comments and information shared here. Your Orthodox heritage is rich and needs to be revealed and expressed to us in the west.

          • Kkdgrace

            Amen!

      • Grandmere

        What would we do without you, dearest brother? I have learned so much from you.

        • Cuzick

          Amen

        • Стефан Евгений

          I Just read thats all.

      • Cuzick

        Have been there ? My daughter in law is adopted from Romania.

        • Стефан Евгений

          No I was born in far western Ukraine.

      • This is my definite favorite Steven:

        What are the words?

        • Стефан Евгений

          Cantor or (Kanonarkh) refers to a singer or reader who announces in chant the tone and opening text of a hymn before it is taken up by the choir.
          Lavra* a Monastery. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavra
          Here are bell ringers in Donbas.

          • Стефан Евгений

            O Lord, have mercy

            The bells’ chime
            Is floating above the earth,
            And in the monastery
            The fraternal choir is singing:
            Refrain- O Lord, have mercy.

            The Cantor-monk
            Has bowed to the ground.
            And the bells’ chime
            Fell silent at once.
            – O Lord, have mercy.

            – O Lord, I cry to thee, –
            The tenor has proclaimed,
            The choir has harmoniously
            Echoed to the Cantor.
            – O Lord, have mercy.

            Candles, icons,
            Vestments, crosses.
            The Lavra is singing
            In a sad sixth mode
            – O Lord, have mercy.

            Pilgrims are standing,
            The people are praying.
            Rus’** is still alive,
            Rus’ is still singing.
            – O Lord, have mercy.

            There are ascetics on crosses,
            Beards, like snow,
            Having lowered their eyes,
            They pray for all.
            – O Lord, have mercy.

            With such music we
            go even toward death!
            Is there much to sing to you,
            Holy Rus’ ?
            – O Lord, have mercy.

            Your turn has come.
            Young bell-ringer,
            Awake everyone around,
            Strike as hard as you can.

            The fraternal choir fell silent,
            The bells are chiming again.
            But I can only here
            All around:
            – O Lord, have mercy.

          • Beautiful, thank you Stephan. “Holy Rus” I like it.

            I sent you email. You get it?

          • Стефан Евгений

            Yes!

          • Kamau41

            AWESOME!!!!! Thank you for sharing. Music to our ears.

          • Стефан Евгений

            The song has bell sounds in it Kamau, have you ever heard Russian bells?

      • racarrera

        And his is a sublime cantor.

        • Cuzick

          When can we expect more Orthodox wisdom from your perspective ?

          • racarrera

            Soon, my friend.

      • Kkdgrace

        I love your links! Bless you!

  • Alexander

    “So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination of desolation,’ described by the prophet Daniel (let the reader understand), then let those in Judea flee to the mountains…”

    If the scenario you described is referring to the Eucharist, then why are the people of Judea told to flee to the mountains when they see it? I’m not defending the Temple institute by any means, just trying to make sense of how this all adds up.

    • Great question.

      You have two issues here. If you look at the text:

      “Then I heard ta holy one speaking; and another holy one said to that certain one who was speaking, “How long will the vision be, concerning the daily sacrifices and the transgression of desolation, the giving of both the sanctuary and the host to be trampled underfoot?””

      Notice, first is the abolition of the “daily sacrifices” AND THEN there is another event the “transgression of desolation” these are two separate events, one is regarding the Eucharist and the other is placing an abominable thing inside a holy place which we do not know where. There are no verses that says this last one will be in Jerusalem.

      The latter will mark the time when Judea is invaded which is described n several passages in scripture (Ezekiel 38, Psalm 83, Zechariah 9, Zechariah 12, Zechariah 14 …)

      So in other words, the Christians are persecuted first and then the Jews will get it next. Just because it says “Judea” does not mean that this other abomination is speaking of a temple in Jerusalem. The two events (one a desecration of the host and the other a desecration of a holy place) happen simultaneously.

      In fact, the text does not mention Jerusalem at all in 2 Thessalonians:

      “for [that day shall not come], except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who oppose and exalts himself above all that is called God, or that is worshiped; so that he as God sits in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.” (II Thessalonians 2:4)

      It does not say “Jerusalem”. If it is a Muslim Antichrist he might enter Hagia Sophia as fulfillment. It was after all called the temple of Christ, the Word of God … and Erdogan keep s speaking of converting it back to mosque.

      So it is possible that if this happens, the people of Judea should flee to the mountains because they are next in line since Antichrist would have already commissioned an invasion of Jerusalem as described in Zechariah 12 and 14.

      • Ceirwyn

        That makes a lot of sense. And isn’t there a Jewish temple being built in Turkey right now? Sounds like Israel should be concerned when that gets finished.

  • “Something an individual can do daily or with family or friends..”

    I am always amazed at grasshopper interpretation. Whats next. Can we add a six pack of bear and a few smokes as for ‘incense’ and say this is a ‘valid interpretation’?

    • Cuzick

      Don’t forget the NFL jersey as their vestment while ” having communion ” at the stadium instead of being in church.

      • Grandmere

        Would that be a Saints jersey? lol

        • Cuzick

          Lol ! SNAP !!

        • Cuzick

          SNAP !!!

          • Grandmere

            Don’t forget the praise band or the “offering buckets”. That guy in the red t shirt needs a “fresh anointing” before he falls off his chair. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uLpojeYm9Y

          • Cuzick

            The ” Saints ” had ” church ” on the way to the game ! Lol. !!

          • David W

            I am so out of touch with the seeker sensitive P&W!

            It used to be Hawaiian Shirts, espresso machines, smoke-free worship with juice and crackers, free wifi, and the pastor reading news stories about the EU and the Russian military. The closest we got to incense was the automated deodorizers in the bathrooms. Sola Scriptura, indeed!

            But still, it was not as frightening as my Vineyard days of clucking, dancing, barking, roaring, spontaneous “prophesies”, uncontrolled laughing and falling down backwards. May God have mercy upon me for my idolatries…

          • Grandmere

            I had no idea, David. Can you share how you found the exit?

          • Grand, whatever happened to Superman? Is he on the same fast as the rest of you who fasted from my Falafel stand?

          • Grandmere

            The last I heard from him ( two or three months ago?) he was getting one of his books published. I’m gonna check on him tonight and see what’s up. I’ll let you know. Either that or pull on his cape and get him to check in.

          • Thank you Grand. I knew that I can depend on you that while I watch the 99 sheep that you would fetch the one that went astray.

          • Grandmere

            Chef, was I wrong to call the grasshoppers loons? I seem to be a stumbling block to Grace.

          • Grandmere

            Superman has been polishing his novel and has been fasting from websites for Lent. He said to tell you he will be back soon.

          • Kamau41

            Just heard back from Superman and confirmed that he is doing quite well. Yes, he too has been taking the Lent break from all social media. He will be returning though after Lent stronger than ever. Just curious, what punishment will Superman be getting?

    • Grandmere

      He was on the third floor a while back but checked out “against medical advice”. I don’t know if we are going to have space enough by midnight, when the real loons come out.

      • Do these grasshoppers even understand what a refutation means? We make an argument against their claim, but all they do is repeat that same claim.

        Its a sign of manic depressive illness.

        • Grandmere

          They got their debating skills in kindergarten. Scream, hold your breath, throw yourself to the ground, tell the teacher she’s mean.

  • “we daily sacrifice our lives to God,”

    Have you read the article and tried to answer all the Jesus-style questions? How can Antichrist stop such a daily sacrifice?

    If you ‘daily sacrifice’ tell us how can Antichrist stop this? Even if he persecuted you for ‘sacrificing daily’ you would still be ‘sacrificing’ right? So this means that he ‘cannot stop’ your ‘daily sacrifice’.

    Checkmate. Jesus-style.

    • magaforever

      I bet she still constantly attacks the catholic church even after you exposed her folly to her

  • Indeed I am. And I ask God to plague me with what you think is madness and that I may never recover.

    • Grandmere

      Dr. Shoebat, it’s strange. Every time we check a patient in on the third floor they all seem to think you are crazy.

      • You know what we say Haldol Happens.

        Its the Haldol effect, if you give and extra one or two cc it creates that effect where the mad think we are mad.

        He says “You’re going mad Walid!”

        Amazing. He fulfills a prophecy:

        “A time is coming when people will go mad and when they see someone who is not mad, they will attack him, saying, “You are mad, you are not like us” – St Anthony the Great.

        And that was 1,500 years ago!

        • Kamau41

          That quote from St. Anthony the Great is certainly becoming much more real by the day.

  • Kamau41

    “Again, the conflict between Christians and grasshoppers is the conflict between the tangible and the abstract. To believe in the abstract while ignoring the tangible is the crux of the whole issue of Christianity.” Another very timely and double blockbuster piece, Brother Walid.

    • Thanks 41. And now you know why we row in the midst of the sea where no grasshoppers can reach us. In other words, may God bless the grasshoppers and keep them far away from us.

      • Kamau41

        Indeed I do. Totally love it.

  • Marcos Filipe Guerra

    I love to hear father Seraphim’s hymns. Beautiful. Well, although I get the Eucharist as being a perpetual sacrifice, and that by prohibiting it is the abomination, these verses still confuse me with a physical Temple, not the one in Jerusalem by the way, which I believe will be built when Jesus comes back.

    “Let no man deceive you by any means: for {that day shall not come}, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
    Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.”

    2 Thessalonians 2:3,4

    If the Erdogan only prohibits the Eucharist, without any big event, then it’s just the Eucharist. If he prohibits the Eucharist with a big event in Hagia Sophia, then it would be both physical and spiritual Temple.

    Reading those verses I got the impression that the antichrist does both things. He would prohibit the grain offering and drink, while declaring himself as the owner, or god of Hagia Sophia, the main symbol of Christianity to the eastern church. It is mourned until today by Orthodoxs.

    I’m working here with the prohibition of the Eucharist as being the reference to the abomination of desolation, because it’s by far the most important element, with the physical temple being a secondary fulfilment. So, if there should be a literal physical Church/Temple it must be a symbol to all Christendom and it must happen simultaniously to the prohibition of the Eucharist. Maybe both things happens, as we see Erdogan wanting Hagia Sophia to be a mosque. He might do both things at the same time.

    “And after the threescore and two weeks shall the anointed one be cut off, and shall have nothing: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and even unto the end shall be war; desolations are determined.
    And he shall make a firm covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease; and upon the wing of abominations [shall come] one that maketh desolate; and even unto the full end, and that determined, shall [wrath] be poured out upon the desolate.”

    Daniel 9:26,27

    Hard to predict. An excellent article Mr. Shoebat, one I will have to read again with much more attention.

    • Read my response to Alexander above. I fully agree.

      • Marcos Filipe Guerra

        Soon after I finished that, I looked for other comments and saw your response to him. Thanks!

  • Doc

    Another great article. One need only look to the manna from Heaven in the Old Testament to understand it as an archetype of the Eucharist.

  • Tom_mcewen

    The temple is another attempt to trap God and bend him your will, God has moved on, the Temple is a relationship gone bad, both parties have the right to change the arrangements of their relationship and God changed the arrangement. The Babylon tu

  • Doc

    May we all suffer from the same madness

    • Grandmere

      Amen.

    • These fulfill a prophecy:

      “A time is coming when people will go mad and when they see someone who is not mad, they will attack him, saying, “You are mad, you are not like us” – St Anthony the Great.

      • Doc

        Interesting. I have an idea for a new book for you Walid: compile the prophecies like this and show how they are being fulfilled in modern times. I can think of no better testimony. I’d buy a copy.

        • “I’d buy a copy”

          Thanks Doc, but I’d rather give it to you for free.

          • Doc

            Thanks, Walid, but better to give the “free” one to someone who needs to be saved and might believe after reading it. 😉 Either that, or I would accept your free one with many thanks and donate it to someone who desperately needs to read it after I’m done with it.

          • Doc,

            Ask for my life and I will give it FREE 🙂 for what better love than one to die for his friends.

          • racarrera

            Then I’ll buy it.

          • Kkdgrace

            Rudy! Haven’t “heard” much from you lately! How is life treating you? My prayer is that you experience many blessings!

          • racarrera

            I’ll be catching up shortly!

          • racarrera

            Life has kept me very busy, including trying to find work that will get me back around Orthodox again, because this place is devoid of those I can form a community around (outside of my family, who keep me sane). My health has been bouncing around, but now, everything seems stable, and I’m able to enjoy the company of my friends here as we prepare for the Harrowing of Hell and the destruction of Death itself. May you and yours have a wonderful Pascha.

            Hristos Anesti!

          • Kkdgrace

            It is SO good to hear from you! You know I consider you to be a mentor of mine. Hope that life settles down for you. I will most definitely keep you in my prayers. I SO want to get more involved with an Orthodox community, especially with regular, frequent worship. I would love for my life to center upon and be consumed by that. Unfortunately, I am caring for a parent with worsening dementia and it’s become dangerous to leave her alone and she is in no condition to be taken anywhere. Also, I have worsening health problems myself. I have had to quit my job, except for some EXTREMELY part time work- for no more than 3-4 hours a week, because of the difficulty finding someone to help watch my Mom. Never in my life have I been in such financial straits. It’s easy to give into anxiety and worry…but then I stop and do a “self-check”: Am I all right now? At this very moment? The answer is always “yes” and I am amazed at how God continually sustains me and mine. I just feel such an urgency in my heart about my ability to attend and participate in worship and with a community of like believers, especially as I am a “newbie” to all this. Time is growing short, no?
            Anyway- I love hearing from you and most certainly covet your prayers. You will be in mine, of course.
            May you have a most blessed Pascha, my brother. Much love in Christ.

          • Kkdgrace

            I am long- winded, no? Nothing like spilling your guts out in a comment section on the net…except I’ve always felt as if I’m among family at this site. That’s my excuse and I’m sticking to it!!

          • Grandmere

            You are like a cool drink of water, Grace.

      • Filip

        What is hilarious is that people I speak with, my sister and mother all say I’m going mad about Bible prophecy as its coming true.. then indeed! I don’t wanna recover.

    • Kamau41

      Yes indeed Doc.

  • Juan

    The grasshoppers and the Turkish spider are both against Eucharisty and both think about themselves like the Pharisee “God, I thank you that I am not like other people”. They focuse in a the revival of past splendor, new Ottoman Caliphate, new Jerusalem’s Temple with animal sacrifices, etc.
    If Erdogan have put the referendum on Pascha / Resurrection Sunday intentionally he will see soon that he cannot make mockery about Jesuchrist Resurrection.
    No matter if Neo-ottoman project triumph or if grasshoppers have their Temple in Jerusalem. Jesuchrist will be in any place of the Earth where Eucharisty will be celebrated… anyway, it’s better if the West stop it’s harassment against Russia.
    A Western-Russian cooperation will mean a recovery of spiritual values in the West and the possibility for Russia to avoid a lethal and antinatural alliance with Turkey and Turkic countries.
    Eucharisty and West-Russia cooperation for the good of Apostolic Christianity is the recipe against gnostic deceivers.

    • Grandmere

      We could see an earthquake level his shiny new palace.

      • Juan

        I think it depends on his inner intention… if he is making mockery or despising Jesus Resurrection he will taste God’s punishment for sure.

  • Tom_mcewen

    I am slow I am still trying to wrap my mind around the EU and the Pope meeting, the two are different species, fish and fowl neither sharing a common language. God does work in mysterious ways. There will be war, but what kind and how deep? This must be a manifestation of the most primitive part of the brain to frighten the Secular humanist Marxist brain for politicians to listen not talk.

    • AnthonyM

      The meeting was a surprise to me. Pope Francis sees rising European nationalism as bringing back totalitarian rule. Many see nazism rising in Europe as a result of their secular society being upset by unrestricted immigration of muslims. The EU leaders are looking for peace and stability in governing the people.

      The EU as an organization seems to be dying, with nothing to replace it or stem the tide. Pope Francis offered ways that Europe can find new hope and to find new ways to steer its course. Possibly just a talk of encouragement.

      There is a link to the March 24th speech thru Jimmy Akin’s site:
      http://jimmyakin.com

      • Tom_mcewen

        The EU is the most expensive program of peace in history. It foundation is rotten and symptoms it tries to cure brought a worse plague. It is said, fight fire with fire, this is a war between Gods and the EU doesn’t believe in God at least not a God who doesn’t behead you that God they believe in. The EU is Marxist, as man being a economic animal, that has shown to be a failure, but nothing is defended​ as like a failed theory by an academic, a million deaths will not change his mind. This sitting quietly in the corner doing nothing to attract attention doesn’t work, the appeasement of France in the Rhineland and the English appeasement by abandonment of Czechoslovakia doesn’t work, I am military and to me violence is an answer, I am a man with a hammer looking for a nail. There is a tide that runs in the affairs of men that that taken at the flood

        • AnthonyM

          Liked your comment, esp ‘nothing is defended​ as like a failed theory by an academic’. A warrior with a poetic bent? Was surprised to learn General James M.D. Mattis travelled with a library larger than the number of books I have ever read.

          • Tom_mcewen

            I like Marx sitting in the British library living on borrowed money never paid back, Writing in order for his theory to succeed millions of of the unsuitable pawns had to be removed. How simple is an academic to suffering. Those who followed his logic agreed and heads were bent and shots fired. Academics are the father of the EU and of replacement population to keep a killer called welfare Ponzi schemes breathing. Breathing people are always the threat to the problem.

        • Cuzick

          Well said Tom.

        • Vinny Zee

          Always good to just follow your wisdom Tom.

  • Filip

    Walid, How would you answer this in regards to the Catholic Christian faith?

    Question: “Are the seven Catholic sacraments biblical?”

    Answer:
    “Sacraments are outward signs of inward grace, instituted by Christ for our sanctification” (taken from the Catholic Encyclopedia).
    The Roman Catholic Church teaches that while God gives grace to man
    without outward symbols (sacraments), He has also chosen to give grace
    to man through visible symbols. Because God has done this, man is
    foolish to not make use of this God-provided means of gaining
    sanctification.

    In order to qualify as a sacrament, the Roman Catholic Church states
    that it must meet the following three criteria: a) the external, that
    is, a sensibly perceptible sign of sanctifying grace, b) the conferring
    of sanctifying grace, c) the institution by God or, more accurately, by
    the God-Man Jesus Christ. Thus, sacraments are not merely a symbol, but
    are believed to actually confer sanctifying grace upon the recipient.
    The Roman Catholic Church believes that all of their seven sacraments
    were instituted by Christ Himself. There are seven Roman Catholic
    Sacraments, and they are as follows:

    1) Baptism, which the Roman Catholic Church teaches removes original sin while infusing the act with sanctifying grace.

    2) Penance, in which one confesses his/her sins to a priest.

    3) The Eucharist, considered the reception and consumption of the actual body and blood of Christ.

    4) Confirmation, a formal acceptance into the church along with special anointing of the Holy Spirit.

    5) Anointing of the sick, performed by a priest using oil. The priest
    anoints the sick person´s forehead and hands with oil. This is
    associated not only with bodily healing but with forgiveness of sins.
    When performed on a dying person, it is called Extreme Unction (or last
    rites or final anointing).

    6) Holy Orders, the process by which men are ordained to clergy.

    7) Matrimony, which provides special grace to a couple.

    The following are verses commonly cited to support the Roman Catholic
    belief concerning the sacraments: “Therefore I remind you to stir up the
    gift of God which is in you through the laying on of my hands” (2 Timothy 1:6).
    “Jesus answered, ‘Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of
    water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God’” (John 3:5).
    “Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His
    mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of
    the Holy Spirit” (Titus 3:5). “That He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word” (Ephesians 5:26). “If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained” (John 20:23).
    “And the prayer of faith will save the sick, and the Lord will raise
    him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven” (James 5:15). “Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit” (Acts 8:17).
    “Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will
    raise him up at the last day. For My flesh is food indeed, and My blood
    is drink indeed” (John 6:54-55).

    It might seem by looking at these verses by themselves that, indeed,
    certain external actions do convey some benefit (such as eternal life,
    the forgiveness of sins, the presence or power of the Holy Spirit,
    etc.). However, when taken in the context of Scripture as a whole, there
    is no foundation for the belief that God ever intended these passages
    to be taken as support for rituals as a means of conveying grace. In
    other words, the whole idea of “sacraments” that convey saving grace
    upon people is unbiblical.

    Two of the main sacraments specifically are said by the Roman Catholic
    Church to be necessary in order to gain eternal life: baptism and
    communion. Because of the Roman Catholic Church belief that baptism is
    required for salvation, Catholics maintain that it is important to
    baptize infants. But nowhere in Scripture can you find even a single
    example or command to do so. Some Roman Catholics use Acts 16:33
    as a possible example, because it states that the Philippian jailor
    “and his family” were baptized. But, taking this verse in context, we
    note two things:

    (1) When the jailor asked Paul what he must do to be saved, Paul did NOT
    say, “Believe on Jesus and be baptized and take communion.” Rather,
    Paul said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you
    and your household” (v. 31). Thus, we see that it is faith that is the
    ingredient necessary for salvation. It was understood that one who
    believed would be baptized, but baptism was not necessary for salvation.
    If it were, Paul would have given it more weight in his missionary
    journeys (1 Corinthians 1:14-18).

    (2) We see that the “family” could not have included infants or
    toddlers, as it states in verse 34 that the jailor had “believed in God
    with all his household.” Infants and toddlers cannot exercise faith in
    God in such a fashion.

    Again and again throughout Scripture, faith, not faith PLUS baptism, is seen as the means through which one receives salvation (John 1:12; 3:14-16; Ephesians 2:8-9; Romans 3:19-26; 4; 10:9-13; etc.).

    Turning to communion, the Roman Catholic Church makes it clear that they take John 6:54
    literally when Jesus says, “Unless you eat of the flesh of the Son of
    Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you.” The problem is that
    their belief that Jesus is speaking literally here is not in keeping
    with the context of the passage in which Jesus repeatedly states the
    importance of faith in Him and His coming atoning death for their sins
    (see John 6:29,35,40,47 and consider the whole message of the gospel of John, as stated in John 20:31).

    When one examines the remaining sacraments, one finds that the belief
    that they convey “sanctifying grace” is not in keeping with the context
    of the rest of the Bible. Yes, all Christians should be baptized, but
    baptism does not infuse us with grace. Yes, all Christians should
    partake of the Lord’s Supper, but doing so does not confer sanctifying
    grace. Yes, we should confess our sins, not to a priest, but rather to
    God (1 John 1:9).
    Having a formal training program and formal acceptance into the church
    is a good thing to do, but it does not convey saving grace. Being
    approved as a church leader is an honorable thing, but it does not
    result in grace. Marriage is a wonderful and blessed event in the life
    of a couple, but it is not the means of how God graces us. Praying for
    and with a person who is dying is a godly thing to do – but it does not
    add grace to our account.

    All the grace we will ever need is received the moment we trust Jesus, by faith, as Savior (Ephesians 2:8-9).
    The saving grace that is granted at the moment of genuine faith is the
    only saving grace God’s Word calls on us to receive. This grace is
    received by faith, not by observing rituals. So, while the seven
    sacraments are “good things to do,” when they are understood in a
    biblical context, the concept of the seven sacraments as “conferring
    sanctifying grace” is completely unbiblical.

    • Let me ask you – was it the eating of the forbidden fruit the cause of the fall or the fruit itself?

      • Filip

        I believe it was the eating of the fruit. God specifically said, Thou shalt not eat of it, for in the day that thou eat of it thou shalt surely die. so God specified in the day that thou eat of it…Now personally I’d say it was the eating because I do not know if the fruit itself caused them to somehow realize that they sinned by some physical aspect of it. It is correct in accordance with God’s Word that the eating of the fruit caused them to die. Specifics..I do not know.

        • So then if it was the eating of the fruit that is the cause of the fall, because the act of eating was disobedience, and God gave a very specific tree which contained the fruit, it doesn’t take much leap to understand the Seven Sacrements the Church maintains is a gift that requires active obedience.

          The Roman Catholic are not alone in utilizing the Seven Sacrements. The Orthodox, Coptics, and Anglican does.

          The Sacrements are gifts of grace which the Holy Spirit via the consecrated priest and the people partake of. Baptism is an outward sign of being “buried in Christ and risen to new life.” Penance is a punishment we should serve to remind us we were bought at a great price. Marriage is the, second to the Eucharist, most important Sacrements as it represents God salvation cooperation with the Church through the union of a husband and a wife, and why divorce is hated by God. Unction, or anointing of the sick, is another Sacrements since James says, “Are there any that are sick among you? Let him call the elders of the Church and let them anoint him with oil.”

          Confirmation, when a new believer or a believer comes into the Church, is given an anointing to be sealed with the Holy Spirit through the laying of hands, a practice that is older than the Church as Moses did the same as he laid hands on Joshua to consecrate him to lead Israel.

          Finally, the Eucharist is the food that believers active consume to partake with the grace of being in union with Christ. It is a mystery how the Holy Spirit upon invocation transforms the bread and wine into Body and Blood of Christ. It’s the very food Christ said He would use to raise us up in the Last Day. Many disciples left Him because it was too hard to accept but Peter and the 11 didn’t leave because as Peter said, “To who shall we go to? You have the truth of eternal life.”

          Then the Antichrist will take away something that is tangible, not an abstract, but something that can seem, touched, and consumed.

          • Filip

            Yes… but where in the Bible it condones the sacraments… as being part of being saved and going to Heaven. For example.. how do you use the Bible to back up that without confession to a priest of one’s sins or those sacraments, you are going to hell.. that seems non-sensical it doesn’t look doctrinal. For example, I do not say throw out the Eucharist, God forbid when that happens it means that the one throwing it out is from the Antichrist. all I’m asking is, why is Catholicism saying, if you don’t get the sacraments, you do not go to heaven, how is that Biblical? How is purgatory Biblical? How is confession of sins the same as confessing sins to one another? Aren’t we all priests of God the moment we become believers and we should indeed confess our sins to one another?

          • Are any of those in the article above? No.

          • “why is Catholicism saying, if you don’t get the sacraments, you do not go to heaven”

            Filip, imagine when you got married, you would tell your wife “I do not want to consummate our marriage. I do not want to have children with you. I do not want to eat your food or drink your coffee. I do not want to share my thought, heart and mind with you …”

            Would you call this a marriage?

            Same with salvation.

            How can one be ‘saved’ if one refuses to do what is required, baptism, confession, communion …

            Actually, its the one who simplifies a relationship to nothing is the one who sounds ridiculous.

            Now, please stick with what is in the article, please.

          • Filip

            That makes sense.

          • Good. Filip, beware of grasshoppers, they eat everything green and they cover the sun so that none of us can see. When you see them, just get in your home and close all shutters 😉

          • Filip

            Always. Speaking of which, can the Eucharist be blessed at home when taken daily?

          • Vinny Zee

            What do you me by “blessed at home?”

            The Eucharist must be instituted/consecrated by a validly ordained priest. One cannot just say the words of institution on their own. This is as it was handed down through apostolic succession.

            However, I am not sure if this was your question.

          • Filip

            Well i was asking that because of John saying that we are all priests of God as Christians

          • Kamau41

            Hey Flip-
            You certainly can’t have Jesus
            without the Church that He started. Review link below that corrobates so well with Walid’s article that further addresses all your questions.
            https://churchpop.com/2017/02/25/why-you-cant-have-jesus-without-the-church/

          • Vinny Zee

            Filip,

            I think you are missing the point on something. Therefore, I need to ask you a simple question. Where does the bible say that doctrines can only come from the Bible?

            Vinny Zee

          • Filip

            Sorry, for the late answer, I believe doctrine can only stem from the bible must be in accordance to it. I was asking about eucharist because my wife and i want to take it daily.

          • Vinny Zee

            I suppose we can get to the Eucharist eventually. But notice your answer. “I believe doctrine can only stem from the bible.” So this is nowhere found in scripture or the church would have taught it to us 2000 years ago. The reason you have a wrong doctrine is due to the fact you make up your own doctrine. It is an easy trap to fall into. The bible does not teach anywhere that doctrine can only come from the bible. Protestants came along in the 16th century and began saying that if a doctrine is not explicit in the bible they would refuse to accept it. However, no church father ever taught us this. So before you can see where the bible teaches the sacraments, particularly the Eucharist, you must first see the Church and understand her authority to define these things. The church defined the sacraments through her teaching authority, her tradition and through the infallible sacred scripture. Paul says in 1 Tim 3:15 that the church is the pillar and ground of the truth. Paul didn’t say you’d know how to behave because the scripture is the pillar and ground of the truth, but the Church. She has been the one who has not only guarded the scriptures, defended them but expounded them for our salvation, of which the sacraments give us that life. Remember, every sacrament is itself grounded in Christ. Therefore, you will not understand the Eucharist if you do not understand the Church’s authority to hold the tradition of the Eucharist passed on to her by the Apostles. This is one of these doctrines grounded not only in scripture, but in the church’s teaching authority and carried on by apostolic succession.

          • Filip

            You re mistaken if you think that Eucharist is not biblical, it is, all good doctrine stems from the Bible, if it does not originate with apostles, tell me then, since any pope can basically come up with doctrine and dogma, by what do you recognize that it is good doctrine? Isn t it by going to the Bible. The way you put it it sounds like if the pope says, God just said to kiss the icon 77 times 7 you ll do it?lol

          • Vinny Zee

            I think if I remember earlier you told me you are Orthodox? I don’t quite understand most of what you are saying. It is like you have a mix of orthodoxy and a mix of Protestantism. Are you a Protestant convert to Orthodoxy or are you born and raised Orthodox? Perhaps you should read the Orthodox response to Calvinism, which they dogmatically condemned as a heresy. You say you agree Catholics are the closest in faith and also believe the Pope can just make up doctrine out of thin air, which is nothing of what the church fathers understood. This is why I said we could talk about the Eucharist/Lord’s Supper another time. I don’t quite get where you are at on some things.

          • Grandmere

            Vinny, I’m letting you take the lead on this. Like you, I am confused about exactly what he believes about the Eucharist. I just want to encourage you. I think he is trying to understand what the Eucharist actually is. I know you have a clear understanding of it. I pray you can help him “get it”, as it clear he is reaching out to you. God bless you. XO

          • Filip

            I will make myself clear sorry for misunderstanding. I was born and raised Eastern Orthodox, I myself Filip Cristian Stroe, adhere to all doctrine and teaching as well as Eucharist and original church father teachings of the Orthodox Church based in the Byzantine Empire originating with the disciples. I told you that Orthodox and Catholic used to be the same religion, but when the Catholics claimed the pope is infallible then we had a disconnect, nonetheless I said, Eastern Orthodox and Catholics are the only sects of Christianity originating with disciples and the closest to original Christianity, compared to protestants,pentecostals,baptists, lutherans, mormons, jehovah’s witnesses etc, Catholic and Orthodox are the only sects that respect original values. There’s even talks now about the two major sects reuniting because of what Erdogan is doing, Cross needs to stay united because the coming of the Lord is near and he will come as a thief at night, this is going to go down the same way it did in ancient times… going to end up being the same war that has been waged since muhammad’s deception with islam in 6th century. Cross vs crescent. ( i don’t capitalize crescent because i do not respect satan’s pagan symbols).

          • Vinny Zee

            I will provide you a response be patient.

          • Filip

            In reply to protestants saying about doctrine, well… they are obviously wrong… the “sacraments” as you Catholics call them in Eastern Orthodox church are a given all 3 happen at one time.. or split they’re just not called sacraments, but they’re the same thing and they are Biblical. Jesus said – Unless one is born again of the water and spirit he cannot see the kingdom of heaven / thus -> someonee needs to be born again baptized with water/ receive Holy Spirit & Take Eucharist as often as they will preferably every Sunday or.. every day if you can. Both Catholics and Orthodoxes have a daily offering of Grain (meat) and Wine (drink offering) The difference is that Catholics use these round things which im not sure if they’re even bread,lol, and Orthodox believe to use unleavened bread as Jesus had at the time when he broke bread with disciples.

            This is what the Orthodox church says.
            Differences between Catholic and Orthodox.

            Is there purgatory as Catholics say?
            Orthodox answer: There is no purgatory. Catholics say that between Heaven and Hell there is a large fire where the soul goes a few hundred years to cleanse and then it passes on into Heaven.
            Orthodox answer: This does not exist. We as Orthodox have the Gospel of Judgement as a church doctrine which Catholics also have, but ours does not show three places.. but two, either heaven or hell, there is no inbetween just as Jesus says, if you be warm in the faith, I will puke thee out of my mouth, I would rather have thee be cold or hot in the faith, for no one can serve to masters, he is either loyal and obedient to one and disobedient and unloyal to another or vice versa.
            When Jesus will stand on the throne of his Glory and he will bring all nations before him to judge them he will divide them as a shephard divided the sheep from the goats. The righteous on his right hand and the unrighteous on his left hand. There will be no middle ground.The sinners in eternal damnation and the right doers in eternal life with God. Therefore we as Orthodox cannot say there are three places to include a Purgatory.
            What are the principals that differentiate us from Catholics?
            The main teachings that depart us dogmatically are as follows:
            1.) First there is filioque. They (Catholics) say that the Holy Spirit comes both from the Father and The Son. This dogmatic mistake is the heaviest one between Orthodox and Catholic. Saint John says that the Holy Spirit comes from the Father and is sent to the world through the Son.
            2.) The second is the papal supremacy. Pope is considered of Catholics to be the supreme head of the Christian church, in other words the replacement of Christ on earth! Higher than all other patriarchs! This is something the Universal original Church never did. We call this a devilish pride. The Pope calls himself the follower (descendant) of Saint Peter (the disciple)!
            3.) Papal Infallibility. Catholics say that the Pope cannot be mistaken (ever), as just a man, in material of faith and doctrine. They believe when the Pope decrees something or preaches something he cannot possibly be mistaken. This Dogma is rejected by the Orthodox church.
            4.) Purgatory (already discussed above)
            5.) Eucharist, what bread is used. (This one is being slowly discarded by both sides, Catholics & Orthodox in terms of agreements on what the bread exactly is as long as it is grain offering (meat) this does not mean however that it must stop, it must be a perpetual daily sacrifice pleasant to the Lord.
            6.) Catholics have a new dogma as well. Immaculate Conception. They say that Mary The Mother of Jesus was herself born of the Holy Spirit. This is not true and we disagree (Orthodox) She was born of her God appointed parents Joachim and Ana as a result of their prayer to the Lord the Lord granted it.
            7.) Substantiality. At the blessing of gifts Catholics pray the prayer of invocation of the Holy Spirit, the same we (Orthodox) do as the Holy Epicleza. Catholics say that the gifts become Holy by themselves, when it is being said: “Take, eat…” as part of the prayer. We Orthodox have a separate full prayer of the descending of the Holy Spirit.
            8.) Celibacy of priests. Catholic priests do not marry. They are celibate, against the Ecumenical Councils, which decided that priests may have family.
            9.) The Papal Indulgency. Another led astray path. If you give alms(money,pay) to the Pope lots of it, you can technically sin as much as you want, Pope can forgive you, he can untie you. Their Saints has too many good deeds, they don’t need them and the Pope can sell those good deeds towards the forgiveness of sins of people which do not have enough good deeds. This is in Error we as Orthodox reject this entirely.
            10.) Another Important one is the Annointing, Catholics do not annoint children immediately after the Baptism, but at 7 or 8 years.
            We have the liturgy from Constantinople of Saint Vasil The Great, Grigori Dialogul and Saint John Golden Mouth. And Catholics have the Roman liturgy and the ambrozian liturgy.
            These are the dogmatic points and canonical points which split the Catholic church from the Eastern Orthodox church. And with protestants, we have nothing in common.

          • Vinny Zee

            1. Is there purgatory as Catholics say? – We say yes, however I’ve never heard of a time frame placed on the soul of the one there. St. Cyril of Jerusalem stated, “We commemorate the Holy Fathers, and Bishops, and all who have fallen asleep from amongst us, believing that the supplication which we present will be of great assistance to their souls, while the holy and tremendous Sacrificed is offered up.” There is a consensus and pedigree of belief in the Catholic Church for this doctrine, including Paul’s words in Corinthians and also his prayers for Onesiphorus, who was already deceased when he was asking for Lord to have mercy on his soul in that great day. Finally, because the Catholic church has always held we cannot add any new doctrine to the Scripture or Holy Tradition, this is not a new doctrine. It would be disallowed and found heretical by the magisterium.
            2. Celebacy of Priests – I am eastern rite, our Priests are married, in keeping with the Orthodox Church. However, in the western rite, the church requires her priests to be pure in body as well as in soul and to “present their bodies as a living sacrifice.” Again Paul said he who is free of marriage does not have a divided interest. Although celebacy is not expressly enforced by our Savior, it is however commended so strongly by the Lord and His Apostles by both word and example that the church felt it her duty to lay it down as law.
            3. Papal Infallibility – Peter was conferred on him the primacy over the church and the seats. This is historically recognized. This role is analogous to the High Priest of the OT. (This is a very basic reply.)
            4. Infallible Authority of the Church – The church has the authority from God to teach regarding faith and morals, and in her teaching she is preserved from error by the special guidance of the Holy Ghost. The church is One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic. We cannot hold the scriptures to be infallible if the church does not retain this characteristic. The Protestant notion that God allowed fallible men to write what was infallible is false. Additionally, since the reformation, the Catholic church has been charged with falling into error, which is in violation of Christ saying the gates of hell will not prevail against the church.
            5. New Dogma – The immaculate conception is not a new dogma. The church cannot introduce new dogma.

            I will address 5 and beyond at another time.

          • Filip

            The celibacy part is untrue. Peter was married, Paul was married… it is not requirement, but rather, a good thing to do for those who can.

          • Vinny Zee

            Paul made strong emphasis to it, as did Christ and there are many other examples. The church felt it necessary to place a strong emphasis on this way of life too.

          • Filip

            Give me verses. Also just because someone emphasizes something does not automatically mean they forbid something else. In clearer words. It makes no sense to say.. marriage for priests is forbidden (which is an absolute, not allowing a priest to be a priest if he is married) vs.. emphasizing.. it is better if you can withhold yourself as an emphasized option to celibacy as a priest. If you can not by all means it should be normal for a priest to be married, Just as Peter was and just as Paul was. By doing this, the Catholic church has inherently created an environment where sexual abuse happens in churched and monasteries due to this ridiculous absolute rule, that nowhere in Scripture is even portrayed as an absolute, but as the best option given a few variables.. such as those that are able to do so. Twisting words with exact meanings is not helpful, you know?… That’s why Orthodoxy to this day claims the original creed (Christian Creed of the Apostles and early believers). The Catholic Church has acknowledged this of the Orthodox Church, by the way.

          • Filip

            Not the Infallibility of the Church, but of the Pope, a mere man.

          • Vinny Zee

            Never said the pope wasn’t a man. The pope can even err when he speaks as a private theologian as we all can. The dogma is that when he speaks from the chair of peter on an issue of faith and morals he does not err.

          • Filip

            Immaculate Conception is a new dogma that appeared past 200 A.D with Catholics. Orthodoxes have no notion of such Dogma, nor any evidence of its existence, rather, we have evidence contrary to it.

          • Vinny Zee

            Ok what evidence do you have contrary to it?

          • Vinny Zee

            “Catholics have a new dogma as well. Immaculate Conception. They say that Mary The Mother of Jesus was herself born of the Holy Spirit. This is not true and we disagree (Orthodox) She was born of her God appointed parents Joachim and Ana as a result of their prayer to the Lord the Lord granted it.”

            I have never read the Catholic church teaches Mary was conceived of the Holy Spirit (in the way Jesus was.) That is not the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception. Lk 1″47, Mary rejoiced in God her savior. We bear the stain of original sin, which is cleansed at baptism. Mary would have been conceived in the same way, but God chose to intervene and prevent Mary’s soul from bearing the stain of original sin. He had to save her from the sin the way he saves all of us. With Mary, in a one time special act, he saved her from that sin before her birth. The rest of us are cleansed after our conception. Mary was cleansed by a direct act of God in anticipation for Jesus’ salvific work.

            Substantiality, the descending of the Holy Spirit – in the Roman Rite they as the Lord to send down his spirit like the dew fall so that the gifts may become the body and blood of our savior Jesus Christ. The words of institution are nearly identical in some places. I was taught ultimately it was the descending of the Holy Spirit and the mass (or liturgy) is an unbloody sacrifice.

            Indulgences – The practice of indulgences was not ended however at the Council of Trent and continues today and is defined in the current Catechism of the Catholic Church. The XXV session of Trent affirmed Church authority to issue indulgences and condemned “those who assert that they [indulgences] are useless or who deny that the Church has the power to grant them.” The council did eliminate the misuse and the so-called selling of indulgences which Martin Luther (and others) found repugnant.

          • Стефан Евгений

            Sorry brother, but ‘Penance is a punishment” you must be reading Anselm of Canterbury.
            “Enter into the church and wash away your sins. For there is a hospital for sinners and not a court of law.”
            St John Chrysostom. Do you beat a sick man, or give him medication?
            Confession: The Healing Sacrament.
            http://www.antiochian.org/content/confession-healing-sacrament

          • Did I miss that one?

            Shoot, back to swapping the deck.

          • Стефан Евгений

            Da! moy brat, Da!

          • Can’t wait to partake in my first confession next Friday. Looking forward to Holy Week! God is so good!

          • You are confessing Trevor? Finally. When will you take the Communion?

          • If all goes well, the confirmation should be in August when the Bishop come in town. Keep in mind this is an Anglican Catholic Church.

          • David W

            Awesome, Trevor. I have my confession scheduled for Friday, and my baptism on Saturday (Lazarus Saturday in the Orthodox Church).

          • Awesome! So happy for you!

          • Kamau41

            Welcome home David.

          • Vinny Zee

            What is an Anglican Catholic Church? Either it is Anglican and thus Protestant or it is Catholic. But I would need to hear more because I’ve not really heard of such a thing.

          • Vinny Zee

            Okay Trevor you’re going to have to educate me because I was already quickly accused of judging you, which I was not. When people tell me “don’t judge your brother” It is like calling someone a “racist.” I often see it as a way to shut down the conversation or change to tone of the conversation. So I’m certainly not looking for an argument. When I stated “I’d never heard of an Anglican Catholic” it was because I’ve never heard of an Anglican Catholic.

            So I checked out the website. I was not been able to find out what jurisdiction they fall under to call themselves Catholic. Here is my perspective and I’d love to hear your reply when you have time.

            Catholics of the Byzantine tradition in the Austro-Hungarian Empire were known in church terminology as Ruthenians. They came back into communion with Rome in the 1640’s. Large numbers of them began to immigrate to the United States in the late 1870s and their first church building was in Shenandoah, Pennsylvania. These Catholics were placed under the jurisdiction of the Latin ordinaries of the places of residence by virtue of the Apostolic Letter of Pope Leo XIII Orientalium Dignitas (1895). In 1913 their Bishop was accorded full ordinary jurisdiction and independence from the Latin ordinaries.

            On July 20, 1956, Pope Pius XII created the Apostolic Exarchy of Stamford, Connecticut, assigning to it the parishes situated in the State of New York and in all of New England. On July 12, 1958, Pope Pius XII established the Ecclesiastical Province of Philadelphia, consisting of the Archeparchy of Philadelphia of the Ukrainians, and the Eparchy of Stamford, CT.

            On July 14, 1961, Pope John XXIII separated the western part of the Archeparchy of Philadelphia comprising all the states of the U.S.A. west of the western boundary of Ohio and on the West of the Missouri and Mississippi Rivers, and established it as the Eparchy of St. Nicholas of Chicago for the Ukrainians. In December 1963, Pope Paul VI recognized the Metropolitan Archeparchy of Lviv-Halych as a major archiepiscopate, one of the autonomous (sui iuris) churches of the Universal Catholic Communion under the primacy of the Roman Pontiff as successor of St. Peter. Jurisdiction is established in the Code of Canon Law of the Eastern Churches. Vatican II and Pope John Paul II in the Eastern Code of Canon Law defined the self-governing autonomous church administered as a Patriarchate.

            I know in times past, Anglican priests have been received into the Roman priesthood, but I always understood they left Anglicanism to do so. The same with Anglicans who came home to Rome. I never understood there to be any Anglican Catholic churches as with the Ukranians for example. They were allowed to maintain their Orthodox roots in communion with Rome. This is the case with all eastern Catholic churches. My point in all of this is that I do not see such a jurisdiction discussed on the website. In what way are the Anglican Catholics claiming the jurisdiction and succession to Peter and the Catholic Church?

            I was not aware of any decision by Rome to allow the Anglicans to maintain their Rite like the Eastern Catholics were and be considered in Communion with Rome. I’m interested to hear more.

          • The website I shared with you only gave the basic about the ACC itself. Apparently they were episcopal before being separated and forming as Anglican Catholic in respond to the worldliness progressive The Episcopal Church were undertaking. So I guess start from the formation The Episcopal Church and trace their lineage?

          • Vinny Zee

            That website makes more sense and answered my questions. Thanks.

          • As far as I know, the parish I have been visiting is part of the ACC, under the Diocese of Mid-Atlantic State with the Archbishop in Georgia, and our current Archbishop is Mark Haverland.

            Grandmere, as you may or may not know, is part of the Anglican Church of North America, in communion with GAFCON. GAFCON is located mainly in Africa and they are very Orthodox.

            Here is how the GAFCON are responding to Abp. Welby of Church of England the direction he is taking, or rather trying, Anglicanism toward. https://www.gafcon.org/news/chairmans-march-2017-letter

            The other day, I received in my email, more revelation on how devious Abp. Welby is. He has been undermining activity taken by GAFCON to be reconciled with Rome, and I told Grandmere in private that my advice to GAFCON would be to eschew relations with CoE and do everything they can to have reconciliation mission with Rome. I am very, very encouraged to see that Orthodox Anglicans are arriving at the realization they need to reconcile with Rome after 500 years of separation. I am also very encouraged to have learned that Pope Emeritus Benedict, before he was forced out (I refuse to believe he retired on his own merit), recognized the desire for Anglicans to join force with Rome and was instrumental with helping establishing Ordinariate for Anglicans to become Roman Catholics while maintaining elements of Anglicans liturgy.

            It is my solemn hope that the ACC will join in communion with the ACNA, GAFCON, and eventually Rome.

          • Vinny Zee

            Well you’ve hit my nerve on something that really is what seems to have more puzzle pieces that solution possibilities. Let me just say I have not delved too deeply into the Anglican/Roman relationship in recent years to really speak in an educated fashion about it. The bigger issue we have, as you have well pointed out, is a Pope Emeritus and a Pope. 4 years ago I guess I thought Benedict was in his waning days as he resigned and Francis was appointed. However, as the years progress, it only stirs the pot deeper into the reality of what has happened and has been happening.

            I am grateful for those Anglicans who have maintained Orthodoxy and are desiring to return home. However, my bigger issue has been ecumenism, something I’ve never been shy about expressing my displeasure with. Yes, we need to call all people home to reconciliation. Unfortunately, the mode in which it is carried out by some sectors of the church is not done with Orthodoxy in mind but modernism. Every pope that has ever addressed it, condemned modernism. Unfortunately, we have had 50 years of its embrace. It is like handling a dangerous snake one thinks they have tamed. My point being, there are many undertaking ecumenism at the expense of orthodoxy. That is a problem for me. Am I opposed to ecumenical dialogue? In today’s day it is necessary. However I am never in favor of sacrificing doctrine for compromise. These are general thoughts, not meant to be steered toward any work between the Anglicans and Rome. Unfortunately with the current pontificate it appears every thing is up for debate, reconsideration and change. This is something the church had always been fundamentally against.

          • I think I understand what you are saying. We are truly in the midst of the falling away when doctrine and tradition of the Church are being re-invented, re-interpreted, and given modern twist.

            Doctrine of demons has truly infiltrated the Church worldwide – whether it is at the See of Peter, the See of Canterbury, or wherever, we are seeing signs of the impending judgement sent by God.

          • Vinny Zee

            Well one would have to wonder if Pope Urban II was holding mass today in St. Peter’s what his response would be when he received word of the attack on the churches in Egypt? I had a good discussion with my priest today about whether my fasting is what it should be. I think in the final analysis this is going to be the only answer we have left. Prayer and fasting. The refining of the faithful.

            I read somewhere of a quote of St. Francis of Assisi which was taken from the Works of the Seraphic Father St. Francis Of Assisi [London: R. Washbourne, 1882], pp. 248-250. Not verbatim, but because there were paragraph breaks, but it states the following:

            “Act bravely, my Brethren; take courage, and trust in the Lord. The time is fast approaching in which there will be great trials and afflictions; perplexities and dissensions, both spiritual and temporal, will abound; the charity of many will grow cold, and the malice of the wicked will increase.” – Here when I see perplexities it just reminds me of the increasing theological confusion being heaped on a great many people, terrible persecutions and the increase in the love of pleasure and wealth. The statement continues:

            “The devils will have unusual power, the immaculate purity of our Order, and of others, will be so much obscured that there will be very few Christians who will obey the true Sovereign Pontiff and the Roman Church with loyal hearts and perfect charity. At the time of this tribulation a man, not canonically elected, will be raised to the Pontificate, who, by his cunning, will endeavour to draw many into error and death.” – It is not specific, so I will not be specific. Of course people love to rush to this statement today and accuse it of being the current or last few popes. I’m not going there, but I am not turning a blind eye to what St. Francis is warning either. Continuing:

            “Then scandals will be multiplied, our Order will be divided, and many others will be entirely destroyed, because they will consent to error instead of opposing it.” – Oppose anyone or even gently question and you will be reviled, accused, and called a judge of men. The prophecy Continues:

            “There will be such diversity of opinions and schisms among the people, the religious and the clergy, that, except those days were shortened, according to the words of the Gospel, even the elect would be led into error, were they not specially guided, amid such great confusion, by the immense mercy of God.” – There is great hope we can avoid the error of the “perplexities” mentioned earlier, but the faithful must be diligent. We must, as the scriptures tell us, guard our life AND our doctrine closely.

            “Those who preserve their fervour and adhere to virtue with love and zeal for the truth, will suffer injuries and, persecutions as rebels and schismatics; for their persecutors, urged on by the evil spirits, will say they are rendering a great service to God by destroying such pestilent men from the face of the earth. But the Lord will be the refuge of the afflicted, and will save all who trust in Him. And in order to be like their Head [Jesus Christ], these, the elect, will act with confidence, and by their death will purchase for themselves eternal life; choosing to obey God rather than man, they will fear nothing, and they will prefer to perish [physically] rather than consent to falsehood and perfidy.” – This speaks for itself. Finally:

            “Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it under foot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days Jesus Christ will send them not a true Pastor, but a destroyer.” – One has to wonder, will it get even worse then than it is now? Are we in the midst of that now? Either way, if we are in it now or it is coming soon, things are getting worse not better.

            In all of this, I see the faithful are continually reminded to guard themselves, obey the faith, remain steadfast and pursue Christ out of a pure heart. We must remember to do this. There are days like today I am reminded I must guard my own life and doctrine closely to be sure I am abiding in the faith.

          • “One has to wonder, will it get even worse then than it is now? Are we in
            the midst of that now? Either way, if we are in it now or it is coming
            soon, things are getting worse not better.”

            It is going to get worse. I’m not one to mince words, but things are going to get worse. I have spent three or four days studying 2 Esdras 15 and 16. I am fully convinced that we are about to enter the phase prophesied in the passages just cited. I recommend reading it and mediate on them because I believe this is where we are headed.

          • Grandmere

            I don’t know if you subscribe to this newsletter, but it is very good. Here is what Pope Benedict had to say about “dialog” with other religions. I think it is very sound and I miss Benedict so very much. I wish you a blessed Holy Week and Easter. I always perk up when you come in because I value your perspective. https://www.thecatholicthing.org/2017/04/06/ratzinger-on-the-dialogue-of-religions/

          • Vinny Zee

            God bless you Grandmere and have a blessed holy week indeed. We have much to pray about as we are all hearing the news of our Brothers and Sisters coming under attack on this Holy Palm Sunday.

          • Grandmere

            Careful, Vinny, lest you prejudge your brother.

          • Vinny Zee

            Notice, “I would need to hear.” 😉

          • I like it. A clean deck.

    • PaulF

      In John 6 Jesus is not speaking symbolically about eating his flesh and drinking his blood. If he were, his disciples would not have walked away. Even if they did, he would have called them back to clarify that he didn’t really mean it literally.
      Either he meant what he said or John 6 was yet another of those passages included in the Bible by ‘mistake.’
      There are an awful lot of them when you are determined to cut things out.

    • Vinny Zee

      “Two of the main sacraments specifically are said by the Roman Catholic
      Church to be necessary in order to gain eternal life: baptism and
      communion.” – Yes, this is why Pope after Pope has confirmed that outside the Catholic Church there is no salvation. Catholics do not have a problem with this teaching. In fact we affirm it and uphold it.

      “Because of the Roman Catholic Church belief that baptism is
      required for salvation, Catholics maintain that it is important to
      baptize infants.” – This is because the church fathers maintained that Children have no other means to salvation when they are born should they die. The Catholic Church baptizes toddlers, teenagers, adults, elders, whoever comes into the Church for the salvation given by Christ.

      “But nowhere in Scripture can you find even a single example or command to do so.” – You are making the fatal flaw that scripture only is to be the final arbiter of truth. The Catholic Church holds that Scripture, Tradition and Magisterium are our authorities to guard, interpret and dispense the teachings of the Catholic Church that were established 2000 years ago. The Catholic Church does not give “new revelation” say like a Pentecostal church thinks they can do. Therefore, on the authority of the Church, through the tradition handed on to us, we were taught we can baptize our babies as a means to confer the grace necessary for salvation to that child.

      With that, the command and commission of Christ was to go Baptize all nations in the Name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. The commission is in the Trinitarian formula not the mode. Protestants keep trying to make it about the mode. If a protestant comes into the Catholic Church to convert, they are not re-baptized as the Baptist do to the Catholics by trying to tell them their infant baptism wasn’t valid. If a person was baptized, “in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit”, by the Trinitarian Formula, it is considered a valid baptism. However, the Baptist for example, because they are so hung up on the mode, tell Catholics their baptisms are not valid.

      Finally you say, “we note two things.” Who is the “we?” I hope you are not trying to say you speak for all protestants by your protest in your comments? I can assure you, on the issue of baptism, there is not even consensus among protestants. Baptists (and many evangelicals) believe it has to be “believer’s baptism” and the Baptist will let you know when you are a believer or not. The Presbyterians believer in infant baptism. The Church of Christ believes as does the Catholic church that the baptism actually saves. Look it up.

      • Filip

        For the last time pal. Im not a protestant. I am Eastern Orthodox Christian. Was baptized at birth as well as took eucharist and now taking it on a daily basis.

        • Vinny Zee

          Filip,

          I would have never gathered from your comment you were EO. Especially when you concluded with talking about being “born again of the water and spirit” and taking the body of Christ. However when I also saw the “let’s say I’m in the middle of nowhere” argument, which excuse me, is an argument Protestants always lead off with. I am not saying this is you then, if you are saying your EO. However, so many Prots love to do the “middle of no where” argument so they can put their argument in a vacuum. Finally, they way you expressed your comments reminded me of how Calvinists talk about salvation.

          I was not trying to offend you. However, I think you should also look at how the EO church fathers condemned Calvinism and those who attempted to introduce it into EO.

          Blessings,

          Vinny Zee

          • Filip

            Lol. I do not condone half the questions I posed. It’s just that I wanted to know from someone that is more learned as Mr Shoebat on how I would answer a person posing those questions to me.

          • Vinny Zee

            What type of books do you like to read? In depth, researched, scholarly or something that maybe is a little more surface level and easier to understand? There is nothing wrong with either, but I have some recommendations for you depending on what you like to read.

  • Your words fulfill a prophecy:

    “A time is coming when people will go mad and when they see someone who is not mad, they will attack him, saying, “You are mad, you are not like us” – St Anthony the Great.

  • grasshopper=protestant

  • And why doesn’t it make sense? Doesn’t “daily” mean “daily”? What do you want it to mean “nightly”?

  • I think Russia will invade Turkey. But I do not think that China is the 200 million man army, for it says “kings of the east” plural, this comprises several nations. Some of these prophecies I think has flaws. There are no two Gog and Magog. Just one.

    • Стефан Евгений

      I don’t remember China in Elder Paisois sayings Walid.

  • “The just shall live by faith.” (Romans 1:16-17)

    Indeed, but the text does not add “alone” and is what the grasshoppers do. By adding “alone” you have isolated scripture from scripture. You need to first learn what “faith” means. In Genesis was that first incident, God revealed a divide within the body of the faithful where Cain’s ground offering (Cain also believed in God, he spoke to him) was rejected since it symbolically did not include the future sacrifice of the Lamb of God. Abel’s was accepted because it did. This “divide” between “rebel” (like you) and “obedient” went all the way to the end of scripture. It was obedience that determined wheat from tares, sheep from goat, virgin will oil from virgin without … This is very clear when we read the Book of Hebrews, where Abel because he was righteous accepted God’s prescription: “By faith Abel offered to God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, through which he obtained witness that he was righteous.” (Hebrews 11:4)

    Do you see “By faith Abel offered to God a more excellent sacrifice “? Faith and Sacrifice goes hand in hand grasshopper.

    Abel also cared and was meticulous to offer God the best offering.

    This “Faith” includes an “offering” grasshopper. It involves in participating in what God required from ancient Israel with the Passover lamb to the New Covenant with the Communion.

    Both go hand in hand.

    Had you read the article carefully it warned about using words in a stand alone fashion. FAITH is a BIG word which the grasshopper cannot consume just as he cannot consume the true offering of the Eucharist.

    You state: “Paul NEVER taught, nor even came close to teaching & preaching a “gospel” throughout His “13-books” of Holy Spirit-inspired writings – what you’re so heretically presenting as “Divinely-inspired” truth here on your blog!”

    I respond: Neither has he taught what you teach.

    You state: “Plus, you didn’t even consider the fact, nor did it seem you were the least bit concerned, that by leaving-out the most significant portion of Revelation 12:11 – e.g., “…and by the WORD of their testimony, and they loved not their lives even to the point of death”

    I respond: Notice “and by” they both go hand in hand. Yet you divorced the first and persisted to only insist on one: faith alone.

    Listen Grasshopper, I will only say this once. the point of the article clearly reveals that faith and sacrament goes hand in hand unlike your argument that it is faith alone which you had picked up from the anti-Semitic heretic Martin Luther. Had you attempted to answer the Jesus-style questions you would see where you would run into trouble, but instead of answering my question, you tried to accuse. Try next time to quote the Jesus style questions and then attempt to answer them. You won’t because you can’t.

    -“that it would certifiably demolish your entire man-inspired message presented here.”

    You have demolished nothing grasshopper.

    “Since distinguished theologians & bible scholars have long observed, that “Scripture will always interpret Scripture,”

    Which scholars are you speaking of? You didn’t name any.

    “– Matthew 11:25-27; 19:28; 28:18-20; John 1:12-13; 3:14-21; Acts 15:1-29; Acts 26:18; Romans 1:16-17; 4:1-5; 5:1-2; 15:8-9; Galatians 1:1-12…esp. vv.6-9; 2:1-10; 3:1-9; 4:4-7; 6:15-16; Hebrews 7:23-28; 1 John 2:1-2; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12…esp. v.4; Revelation 11:1-2; Zechariah 6:12-15.”

    Definitely grasshopper mentality, always giving references for a grand claim without sharing a shred of text.

    “And Mr. Shoebat, surely you must be aware of the fact, that highly credible scholarship has long-since fixed the writing of the “Book of Revelation,” at roughly 90-95 C.E. – during the reign of the Roman Emperor Domitian – meaning AFTER the destruction of the Jerusalem Temple in 70 C.E.”

    And? Your point?

    “This is called check-mate – Word of God-style!”

    Are you hallucinating?

    “Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. Do not add to His words, Lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar.” (Proverbs 30:5-6.)

    Indeed. You need this verse, desperately.

    Next time you reply, I would expect you quote the parts from the article FIRST and refute away. If you do not do this I will refrain from replying since I do not have time for grasshoppers.

    • Grandmere

      Doctor Shoebat, I told you yesterday that the loons would come out at midnight. We don’t have space available for this case. Where do you suggest we send him?

      • Indeed. They always come a day later. When I used to speak they always sat at the end of the hall. This one above definitely needs help.

        No space? Have them share beds. We have no choice.

        • Grandmere

          I guess we’ll have to use the stable out back. Perhaps that will induce some quiet reflection. Great idea!

      • Grace Ziem

        We may not have time, but we have space. Readers may want to see different views. It is also good for new people to think about what Walid is saying, and thinking people need to express concerns without censorship (tho Walid’s request to him is good)
        ..It is disrespectful to call everyone we disagree with a loon: only God is omniscient. Our search for truth can stand courteous differences and discussion.

        • Grandmere

          Oh, Grace. You just haven’t caught on to my dry sense of humor. It’s still Lent, so I am going to exercise a lot of patience with you. Didn’t you see that I found a place for him in the stable where he could rest and contemplate the bread that came down from heaven and was laid in a feeding trough in a little town known as The House of Bread?

        • Cuzick

          It’s the “drive by ” commenter that has no intention of having a discussion with the hope of better understanding a topic or learning something,but just want to argue is a loon.

          • Grandmere

            Thanks, Cuzy!

          • Grace Ziem

            The commenters in this dialogue can defend their viewpoint without our need to bring in name-calling. when the need to win is so strong we attack people, we are shedding more heat than light…

  • Grandmere

    The word is altar, not alter. I have noticed that this is a very common “mistake” by some people who comment here. It is disturbing. Kind of like misspelling your spouse’s name. If it’s important, you get it right. If it’s not, who cares??

    • Стефан Евгений

      I see the same thing G, even this Hunky gets it right, why can’.t they?

      p.s Hunky, is used as a put down by Americans for East Europeans. Like Hungairian and Sky ending to Slavic names.
      I see so many comments that are puffed up by pride. I’m just a guy who is doing his best on this Earth.
      Walid, gets me thinking…. and others like you dear.

      • Grandmere

        I pray you are feeling better. I always think of you as standing by my side. Your presence comforts me.

  • Dan

    Waild, what the temple institute is saying on the subject of the temple is very simple:

    However, I believe the point is the same as do many Jews and that is Zionism is wrong and if zionism is wrong then the land the Jews want to build a temple on is wrong also.

    Also watch for the man prominent Rabbis have been proclaiming will appear any day now and in fact they believe is alive and well waiting to reveal himself soon.

    What does all of this mean? It means as far as Israel is concerned the signs are there but as for who the antichrist is ; not so much.

    Erdogan Wants To Revive The Islamic Empire as much as any Muslim does but seriously let’s not kid ourselves. Turkey is in no position to do anything that could not be tamped out quick. As much as you want Erdogan to be the antichrist can we at least have an antichrist that is so charismatic he controls the population? Can we at least have an antichrist that fits scripture not just in location but on everything?

    I mean if Erdogan is so loved why did he happen to be in another country during the recent coup and in fact why was there a coup if he is so beloved?

    Are we to believe something will happen to Erdogan that will change him into the antichrist and after we get that will Turkey then be the military to push his agenda?

    Remember Saddam Hussein had the 4th largest military at the time of the gulf wars a military if you recall, who after seeing what an overwhelming force looks like; laid down their arms crying and begging the US forces to take them as prisoners of war.

    We still need an antichrist brother Walid.

    • Grandmere

      Dan, he is in control of the population. Absolute control. He was “out of town” directing the fake “coup” so he could ride in, after crushing his opposition, on a golden chariot with his “enemies” chained and following him in humiliation. He has this referendum in the bag and millions of Turks are hunkered down for fear of losing their employment or their liberty in the new Turkish reality.

      • BINGO!

        • Dan

          Where is that article you promise Shoebat or did you post it and I missed it?

          • Search on the internet for Shoebat and Erdogan. There has been extensive coverage on how Erdogan engineered the coup because he lost patience with the process of democracy and used a perfect scapegoat, his former buddy and fellow Sufi, Gulen.

            I also wrote a couple posts about it on my blog-

            http://atrevorsjournal.blogspot.com/2016/08/the-most-amazing-transformation-is.html

            http://atrevorsjournal.blogspot.com/2017/02/bombshell-erdogan-proclaim-resurrection.html

          • Dan

            I’m talking about the article you were going to write to post on Shoebat.com. It was concerning the meaning of a passage.
            Walid told you if you write it he would post it on his site.

            No, I understand the reasons some feel Erdogan has characteristics of the antichrist but I believe there all too loosely applied to a man who is in no way a charismatic figure or even has a military to do anything if he was.
            Everything needs to fit to scripture.

          • Oh! I emailed it to Theo and I’m not sure if he ever read it.

            The theory is there was a connection between Turkey’s invasion of Syria to the April 16 referendum.

            Erdogan is a charming figure. The problem lies with the over focus on being charmastic. If you look at videos of his rally, he is very popular with his people. His bombastic approach has caused Europe and the United States to jump up and down yet it doesn’t stop them from working with him.

            We are still waiting on one more sign to be fulfilled, that is when he declares to be a god even though he has already been declared as a god by his people. It received little coverage in the West because they don’t care and are in cahoots with the Muslim Brotherhood.

          • You emailed us an article? When?

          • February 20 with a PDF attached.

          • Also don’t be in a rush to post it. I don’t think it was my best work.

          • Dan

            I’m glad you remembered what I’m talking about.
            The theory is there was a connection between Turkey’s invasion of Syria to the April 16 referendum.
            Yes, it was the passage that you were going by that didn’t make sense to me, even after I looked it up. That’s why I was waiting for your article and the fact that Walid thought highly enough of you to use it.

            We will see what happens on April the 16th but if I had to bet I would say it is more likely Erdogan gets himself killed over this.
            I hope that Trump gets rid of The muslims brotherhood connections but i’m not holding my breath over it.

          • I am betting Erdogan gets what he want and pushes Turkey past the point of no return. The Muslim Brotherhood is why Erdogan is jockeying for more power.

            The connection, as I remember, was a passage from Revelation where the angels who were bounded to the Euphrates river were released and slaughtered a third of mankind.

        • I leave for a short while to come back and find you playing BINGO with Grandmere.

          • Grandmere

            No we were not. There is no K-41 in Bingo.

          • AnthonyM

            K-41 is in Binko.

          • Yeah. It’s a fun game. 😉

            Ok, fun time over. Back to scrubbing the lower deck.

          • Cuzick

            After April !6th Erdogan will want to play Monopoly with his neighbors, then BattleShip with with Christendom.

          • Grandmere

            Jesus has one called Armageddon.

      • Dan

        No he’s not in control and he sure doesn’t look like an antichrist.

        http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/01/stream-violence-turkey-shows-president-erdogan-control-freak/

        • Grandmere

          You are not going to get it from A British newspaper. Start reading the Daily Sabah and Today’s Hurriet. Look at the articles, read the editorial and opinion columns. I think one reason E is so fixated on getting votes from the EU crowd is that he sees a low turnout in Turkey. He has purged the military, the civil service, the courts, the education system. You said he doesn’t have a big enough army. Are you kidding? He has a very large, well trained and well equipped army. Bigger than Germany’s. Bigger than Italy’s. Bigger than France’s. And he wields huge influence in the Muslim world. Turkey is head of the OIC. He can call in a lot of IOUs. As far as “looking” like the AC, he denies the Trinity. His charisma with his people is absolutely undeniable. His rallies look like something out of 1939 Germany.

          • Dan

            Erdogan’s army is the fourth largest and do you remember who had the 4th largest in August 2, 1990 ?
            Saddam Hussein.

          • No, Turkey has the 2nd largest army in NATO, second only to the United States, and 2nd to Russia.

          • Dan

            It looks like we’re both wrong but my point is still the same in that Turkey is not a formidable army anymore than Iraq was or Iran is.
            http://www.worldatlas.com/articles/29-largest-armies-in-the-world.html

          • Grandmere

            You are looking at tanks and troops. Turkey is the head of the OIC. If and when Erdogon is declared Caliph, all the world will have to pledge bayat to him. All over the world they will rise up. A worldwide bloodbath. Please, do not dismiss this out of hand. It is real.

          • Dan

            I’m looking at nuclear capabilities GM.

          • Grandmere

            Pakistan, alone, can set the world on fire.

    • Cuzick

      Dan, patience is needed when transitioning from the western interpretation of prophecy . I have been following Mr. Shoebat’s work for a few years and every thing he’s presented is right on track. Keep studying his work and the picture will become clearer as the days unfold. April 16 th will be telling. The caliphate is on schedule for the 2023 year
      range. Western prophecy has so much ” hype ” towards the next big event or personal revelation. I’ve heard them all . No one can compare to Mr. Shoebat in his record of correct interpretation of scripture and history as it relates to world events as they happen. Finish God’s War On Terror and and allow the Holy Spirit to prepare you for the days ahead.

      • Dan

        Oh, I agree when it comes to bible prophecy Walid’s interpretations are different than what I’m accustomed to but his interpretations are also why I am still here. What I believe will happen on April 16 will be a vote of no but if it is a yes Turkey most likely will soon join Syria’s disaster because of it. We still need an antichrist type figure and if it’s Erdogan it will be because he all of the sudden changes into it ah la like in the movies where we see the devil taking him over and now he has powers he didn’t have before. I just don’t see that happening but I’ve been wrong before. Don’t get me wrong I want an antichrist and temple just as much as anybody.

        The book God’s War on Terror and the other book you gave me interestingly enough was what I did this past Sunday but was sidetracked while looking for it online by allegations in the past against Walid Shoebat.
        Granted I will give Walid the benefit of doubt but it was there nonetheless. As for the books I tried to find them pdf but could not so I’ll wait until I can afford them.

        Cuzick, I have been looking forward to the end of days for all of my adult life.

        • Cuzick

          Start with God’s War On Terror, purchase it her on his site. Until your able to read the book , look at the history of Christianity and understand the Bible was written by men with an eastern mindset that Mr. Shoebat understands , you will be frustrated trying to grasp it all with western thinking. Many ” prophecy experts ” have made a fortune selling their books and ministries before Mr. Shoebat exposed their errors. They will not give up the fame and fortune easily. Don’t let any anti Catholic bias stop you from the truth. The pre – trib rapture teaching has created great confusion in the area of end times prophecy. Don’t grow weary in your search for truth.

        • “Don’t get me wrong I want an antichrist and temple just as much as anybody.”

          You want an Antichrist?

          Aaaaaaaamericans.

          • Kkdgrace

            Lol! Walid, you crack me up! Love it when you call out “Aaaaaaaamericans”, when encountering some of our “squirrelly” ways of thinking!
            Really enjoyed reading this particular article. Another excellent piece. Thank you for blessing us with your insight.

            Hope you have a blessed Holy Week and Pascha. Have been longing so very much for the experience of worshipping our Lord’s resurrection in the Orthodox Christian Church. Would appreciate some prayers- that I might find a way to attend services this year- have been significantly homebound of late, as I try to care for a parent with deteriorating health. My soul longs for the corporate worship, as well as the fellowship.

            God bless!

          • “Hope you have a blessed Holy Week and Pascha.”

            You too sister Kkdgrace.

            “Have been longing so very much for the experience of worshipping our Lord’s resurrection in the Orthodox Christian Church.”

            I make all this Catholic Falafel. They like it. They eat. And by the time the holidays come, they cross the street to eat Orthodox Falafels.

            The Orthodox are stealing all my customers.

            Now what do I do?

          • Kkdgrace

            “I make all this Catholic Falafel. They like it. They eat. And by the time the holidays come, they cross the street to eat Orthodox Falafels.

            The Orthodox are stealing all my customers.”

            Now what do I do?”

            Well, you and your delicious Falafels must share in the blame of course! It was my first “taste”- HERE- that started the questioning of so many of my long held Protestant beliefs…and sent me on my lengthy quest through the history of the Church and the writings of the Fathers.

            And, of course, the other culprits are your Orthodox readers and commentors- especially Rudy and Steve. That’s right- blame the “family” : )

          • Grandmere

            I hope you can make it to church, Gracie. XO

          • Cuzick

            Take it like a compliment Chef, you’ve introduced the richness of Apostolic cuisine to the neighborhood. They are just getting a taste of the Eastern original recipe.

          • Стефан Евгений

            Cuzick, maybe it’s our Easter eggs and Easter cakes that bring people over? Or it could be the deep well of our faith, that Christ overcame death and the grave.
            Evil hates joy and love,and it does every thing in its power to stop that joy and love in mankind.

          • Cuzick

            I think it’s all you’ve stated is the reason that those who want to experience the fullness of Gods love and mercy are drawn toward the Orthodox Church . If we as Christians would strive to realize the Church is theanthropic and as Christians we are have received the crown of authority to rule over sin and death in our lives thru our glorious savior Jesus . Let us who love him continue to share the Gospel with great passion and joy .

          • Cuzick

            Great video! Keep them coming my man !!

          • Cuzick

            ” And we kiss the cup of salvation. as it is the very side of Christ. ”
            Speechless beauty.

          • Стефан Евгений

            This is a Russian custom, no other Orthodox do it.

          • Cuzick

            http://www.pravmir.com/why-did-christ-weep-on-lazarus-saturday/
            The wonderful love of our Savior. How can anyone reject him?

          • Kkdgrace

            Do you do this at the mission Church you once told me you were attending? I did a “drive by”, before my mother’s illness made it so difficult for me to leave the house. Always intended a visit but never got the opportunity. I do keep up with the Church’s growth by checking the website periodically. It’s actually closer to where I live than any of the other Orthodox churches in the area. I have watched videos about how the Russian Orthodox churches- in Russia- celebrate the Resurrection. I have always been fascinated by the customs I’ve seen. Russia just fascinates me, period.

          • Стефан Евгений

            Yes in a way, except they dont bless the kulich and paska on Holy Saturday….. That’s right after the service here in America.
            I know what it is like to be homebound. Takeing care of somone is hard, i’ve done it. And now it’s me I have to take care of.

            K, a holy elder in Russia said once, that the people that work out their own salvation in this world. Will out do the monks in a monastery.
            Have a (prayer) corner, like a mini church. that’s where i go often . When my body does not work, or I just can’t make it. I go to my icon corner.and I’m with all those that went before me. I’m with all thoe that are in heaven, and all Orthodox all over the world.

          • Grandmere

            I love that prayer corner.

          • Стефан Евгений

            Most of my icons, are from kin that have passed on. That in a way gives me comfort. that they are with me today.
            My kolbasa is grilling, and pierogies are frying in butter. How I wish your feet were under my table dear! Christ is Risen!

            King’s College Choir

          • Kkdgrace

            Bless you for the advice! Have been intending to fix up my own little prayer corner, complete with an icon and perhaps a candle. Trouble is, I have no idea which icon would be appropriate for me. What other things do you have in your prayer corner? Being homebound, I have been relying on several books about Orthodoxy for ideas as to how best I can practice and live out the Faith on a daily basis. I’m still such a thorough newbie at all of this. Last thing I want to do is “make it up as I go along”. That would be horrible.
            I pray that I may be able to get out and participate in corporate worship sometime in the near future. As a former Protestant and as an American, I fear I am still far too individualistic….. a factor that works against the kind of living and love necessary to be a truly selfless member of the Body- loving and serving others in a manner that imitates our Triune God. I read an article about that today- how the spirit of individualism actually works against the love so necessary for the Body of Christ. And here I have two strikes against me as far as individualism is concerned- American and a long history of protestantism. I need so much work! Please pray for me!

            Take care of yourself, okay? Pray you feel better soon and are able to experience whatever it takes to enable you to be out and about more often. I wish I could be of help to you- I would try, you know, if I weren’t in this particular situation. God bless you brother.

          • Стефан Евгений

            “The Orthodox are stealing all my customers.
            Now what do I do?” Gee Walid! maybe it’s the Easter Eggs we hand out?
            http://1389blog.com/2013/05/04/the-tradition-of-the-paschal-egg/

            It is the joy and happiness, that Erdogan wishes to dump on. The evil one can’t stand the joy of mankind, at the feast of the Resurection of Christ our True God.

          • “Caesar scoffed at her, saying that a man could rise from the dead no more than the egg in her hand could turn red. Immediately, the egg turned red. This is believed to be an explanation for dyeing eggs red at Pascha.”

            We used to dye eggs too at Pascha back in Bethlehem even though we were Muslim. We boiled the egg in onion peel to dye it, Ever tried that?

          • Стефан Евгений

            Yes, the red and yellow onion peel, beet root, and the Greeks use ground up red bugs…. that are on the cactus plants down here in Texas.

          • Kkdgrace

            He can never overcome the joy because the Resurrection means victory, total victory……. no matter what this despotic individual does. It is FINISHED!

          • racarrera

            Remember that we shop here. The spice in the falafel is just right.

          • Стефан Евгений

            Kkdgrace, most of my life here in America, I lived in places without a Orthodox church. It’s hard but i find a way to stop and sing Christos Voskrese!
            I’ll lite a candle for you Sister!

          • Grandmere

            Oh, what a beautiful and encouraging message to our precious little sister, Gracie! As floral artists, you and I know the effort that went into decorating that church. I was filled with joy watching the priest and the people. Thanks, so much. Give the Westies a scratch and a kiss from me.

          • Стефан Евгений

            Candles, comming your way too dear!
            I used to work here Grand, the place left a bad taste in my mouth ever sence. The priest and I butted heads, so I left. (my handywork in the pic) People, never think of what planing and hard work we do to make God’s Altar lovely for his glory.
            I would love to teach a class at your church. The two week wonders at asa never listened to my Wisdom.
            http://www.ascensionandsaintagnes.org/html/mass/mass.htm

          • Kkdgrace

            Bless you!! Also- loved the link!

          • Стефан Евгений

            Happy feast!

          • Kkdgrace

            So lovely, I cried. Thank you. You offer so many of the BEST links. Appreciate it more than you know. God bless brother.

          • Grandmere

            “Oh, the humanity!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”

          • Dan

            Aahaaaaaaaaaaaaaa Arabs !

            Tell me seriously do you really not understand why I said I want an antichrist ?

          • “Tell me seriously do you really not understand why I said I want an antichrist ?”

            No. I am just a camel jockey. I do not understand. Please explain.

          • Dan

            So first its those Aaaaaaamericans and now we’re at
            camel jockey.
            You’re killing me on here Walid.

            Ask yourself what it would mean if the antichrist finally appeared Walid? What would be the big picture here?

            I cannot wait to see the Jews finally build their temple ; same thing.
            Both of these are precursors to מלך המשיח (Meleḵ ha-Mašīaḥ
            correct ?

    • So who is your candidate for Antichrist? Tell us where does Antichrist come from? Educate us. Right now I have elephant ears.

  • “Daniel 9:27 will still have every intention of being carried out at its central themed location of Jerusalem.”

    Okay.

    “What you are suggesting, even though the language of Matthew 24 plainly speaks otherwise, is that one of RCC ‘holy churches’ will play the central theme of the 70th week abomination of desolation, and that Jerusalem might simply be caught up in the action.”

    In my writings, I never was dogmatic about a single view. Please read my response to Alexander. God can if He desires have a building in Jerusalem. The article is not really focused on this issue but the issue of defiling the Communion. The article asks the questions regarding the “grain offering”. Have you tried to answer these? They are under “Jesus style question”.

    “Isaiah 63:v17 Why, Lord, do you make us wander from your ways and harden our hearts so we do not revere you? Return for the sake of your servants, the tribes that are your inheritance. For a little while your people possessed your holy place, but now our enemies have trampled down your sanctuary.”

    You allude that “This is clearly a reference to the tribes of Israel during the tribulation, no one else.”

    Not necessarily. Isaiah 63 like other prophecies which scripture is replete with references to immediate and then long term prophecies. Even if you take your typical Protestant view from Bible commentaries, John Trap, he would not agree with your conclusion:

    “Our adversaries have trodden down thy sanctuary.] This they did in the days of Antiochus, but especially about the time of our Saviour’s incarnation; when the sceptre departed from Judah, Pompey with his army entered into the sanctuary; Herod got the government, the Romans set up their ensigns and statues in the holy of holies, &c. This desolation of the second temple the Jews do here bewail; but we have cause to rejoice, for that by Christ the whole world is now become a temple, and every place a goodly oratory. [1 Timothy 2:8]”

    “Revelation 11 also gives us strong clues as to where the ‘holy city’ and thus temple will be placed: Revelation 11:1 – I was given a reed like a measuring rod and was told, “Go and measure the temple of God and the altar, with its worshipers. But exclude the outer court; do not measure it, because it has been given to the Gentiles. They will trample on the holy city for 42 months. And I will appoint my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for 1,260 days, clothed in sackcloth.”

    My response: “measuring” or “stretched the line” does not necessarily mean an engineer measuring a blueprint. In Lam 2.7–8a, for instance, we find: ‘The Lord has scorned his altar, disowned his sanctuary; he has delivered into the hand of the enemy the walls of her palaces . . . the Lord determined to lay in ruins the wall of daughter Zion; he stretched the line he did not withhold his hand from destroying’.

    2 Kgs 21.13 is of similar character: ‘I will stretch over Jerusalem the measuring line for Samaria, and the plummet for the house of Ahab; I will wipe Jerusalem as one wipes a dish, wiping it and turning it upside down’. In 2 Sam 8.2 measuring has a positive outcome for some, but a negative one for others: ‘[David] measured them with a cord; he meas- ured two lengths of cord for those who were to be put to death, and one length for those who were to be spared’.

    Measuring resembles a judicial process. Example: ‘for with the judgment that you judge you will be judged, and with the measure that you measure you will be measured’

    There are many passages that use ‘measuring’ in a judicial sense.

    In other words, what God marks belong to his jurisdiction. and what he does not measure does not belong to his jurisdiction, but ‘has been given to the heathen.

    Rev 11.1–2 relate how John takes a scroll from the angel and eats it where its first ‘sweet as honey’ in his mouth but ‘made bitter’ in his stomach. This echoes the commission of Ezekiel (Ezek 2.8–3.8)

    With Moses, they ate the sweet then rebelled where they ate the crushed golden calf and tasted its bitterness. They knew God and tasted His sweetness to later fall away. This is the whole crux of Revelation 11. Many allegorize literals and literalize allegories. I too fell for this.

    When reviewing Prophecy you need to penetrate the text spiritually and not carnally. You need to look at the many dimensions.

    God’s Temple (His church) will be tested.

    The measuring instrument ‘like a staff’ this is not used to measure, but to exercise authority, Rev 2.27 “And he shall rule them with a rod …” 12.5 “to rule all the nations with a rod…” 19.15 “he shall rule them with a rod …”

    This “rod” is God’s weapon to judge. The unmeasured part will be ‘rejected’ whereas the measured part will be tested and saved.

    John mentions the temple which is well defined in the New Testament perspective, the “altar” and the “worshipers” to refer to the different parts of the temple service that they represent. The measurement (testing) pertains to the temple service in every facet. We have a an area for incense and one for sacrificial offering. Incense is not something you do but we (Catholics and Orthodox do). The outer court that is left out doesn’t do these since you do not believe that the sacrifice is literal or do you believe in incense as part of the service. So this Temple pertains to the participants.

    This temple and its elements are not literal. For example, ini Rev 11, we have “the two lampstands” are these literal lampstands? If so, how are these two lampstands killed? These are the two witnesses:

    ‘And I will appoint my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for 1,260 days, clothed in sackcloth.” They are “the two olive trees” and the two lampstands’

    So there you have it. Two lampstand are two people. Living. These are not matter. They are not part of a building.

    Its all symbolic, for if it is not then “Now when they (the witnesses mentioned in verse 3) have finished their testimony, the beast that comes up from the Abyss will attack them” would mean they are eaten by some dinosaur for a beast is a beast, right? Wrong. We both agree that a beast is the opposite of the temple.

    “So both the daily (grain/drink) sacrifices in a literal sense at the Jewish Temple, as well as the Passover sacrifice (literal animal sacrifice) may well be stopped through the AOD.”

    Please answer the Jesus-style questions. If such a flimsy answer is true, why would God Himself then support these very sacrifices:

    “where the priests that approach unto the LORD shall eat the most holy things” (Ezekiel 42:13)

    They “shall eat the most holy things”. God calls these sacrifices “holy” and acceptable. This alone debunks such arguments.

    What holy things? Here they are:

    “there shall they lay the most holy things, and the meat offering, and the sin offering, and the trespass offering; for the place is holy.”

    Again, God approves of this sacrificial system. So what is this “meat offering” and this “sin offering” and this “trespass offering”?

    God addresses “meat” and “grain” as if the two are the same sacrificial substance. The only interpretation is to heed to Christ when He broke the bread while stating : “For my flesh [meat offering] is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed” (John 6:55). This is a perpetual sacrifice:

    “For as often as you shall eat this bread and drink the chalice, you shall shew the death of the Lord, until he come.” (1 Corinthians 11:26)

    If it is “unacceptable to the Lord” why then in Ezekiel’s Temple they are ACCEPTABLE to the Lord? Please review my question in the article?

    As you stated: “again a reason why we clearly note that the reinstatement of the sacrificial system at the temple in Israel will not be accepted by christians (as it rejects the sacrifice of Christ”

    Then why are you not paying attention to the MOST CRUCIAL ISSUE?

    “The daily sacrifice that will be stopped, will have no alignment whatsoever with that noted in Malachi 1:11. Why – because their will be no gentiles at all permitted to be part of the Jewish sacrifice (they will be busy trampling down the outer courts!), so Daniel/Revelation/Matthew 24 cannot have any association with Malachi 1:11”

    Malachi 1:10-11 is ENDING JEWISH TEMPLE SACRIFICES FOREVER.

    As long as you miss this point, you miss the puzzle and you miss the true sacrifice which you are NOT partaking in. Therefore, you will be left out of the court.

    “Finally – Your words speak of considerable contempt for those (us lowly grasshoppers) who disagree with your interpretation of scripture.”

    Who loves who here? I for my love of the grasshopper poured out my mind and heart while the grasshopper trampled underfoot God’s holy ordinance.

    You do this right here:

    “Perhaps instead of re-hashing the same ‘anathemas’ declared at Trent”

    And now you attack Trent. Lets not even get into this.

    The question is, will you go the way of the grasshoppers or the way of the sheep?

    • Cuzick

      Your depth of spiritual insight of the Word and ability to communicate in simplistic, to the point terms is truly a gift from God.

  • AnthonyM

    “Salvation = faith in blood of Christ plus NOTHING” is not biblical. Scripture says 3 things are necessary for salvation:
    1st Repentance;
    2nd Faith in Jesus Christ;
    3rd is Baptism.
    And one who truly wants to be saved would do all the things that Christ commanded us to do.

    Jesus said that ‘Not everyone who says to me, “Lord, Lord” shall enter the kingdom of heaven’

  • So what have you learned from this article Chet?

  • “the Holy Spirit is plainly indicating (through the Apostle Yochanon) the actual existence of such a physical “third temple” structure being located in Jerusalem,”

    I will address this in my next Sunday Special.

    The rest of your rhetoric is grasshopper sophism attempting to minimize the subject. I did not use John 6 only.

    I had told you “Next time you reply, I would expect you quote the parts from the article FIRST and refute away. If you do not do this I will refrain from replying since I do not have time for grasshoppers.”

    I see no quotes from my article at all, just an opinion. Therefore, I will not participate in sophism.

    Do you see how I first cut and paste your statements and how I replied statement by statement?

    You need to do the same. Start with the Jesus style questions in my article. Quote the verses (I mean the text, none of that stupid method of making a claim and simply giving a reference).
    Good day.

    • Grandmere

      You need to put him in touch with the other grasshopper who was raving about the Apostle Yochanan being a heretic. I would pay good money to see them beat the tar out of each other.

      • Vinny Zee

        They troll around and think because they say things like, “YHVH” or “YHWH” that they have now miraculously rediscovered the Church we’ve all missed for 2000 years. I guess we’re supposed to be really impressed by these supposed Hebraic expressions that they now have the clout to be in authority. I usually ignore this crowd, but this time around I could not ignore his lies of, “Scripture interprets Scripture.” Then he lectures Walid from Proverbs about not adding to scripture, while at the same time not realizing he is adding to scripture by saying it interprets itself when the bible makes no such claim!

        • Grandmere

          I’m more of a mozel tov and l’chaim type of person. Wishing you a blessed Holy week and a happy Easter.

  • Grandmere

    I’ll put a band aid on it and give you a kiss. My bark is worse than my bite.

  • I have been reading and re-reading your comment and it is just now it dawned on me you butchered your own “checkmate.”

    Here, you write, “Plus, you didn’t even consider the fact, nor did it seem you were the
    least bit concerned, that by leaving-out the most significant portion of
    Revelation 12:11 – e.g., “…and by the WORD of their testimony, and
    they loved not their lives even to the point of death”
    – that it would
    certifiably demolish your entire man-inspired message presented here.”

    Why did you commit a major blunder by cutting out half the verse?

    Here is the entire verse in it’s entirety:

    But they have conquered him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, for they did not cling to life even in the face of death.

    They conquered him, that is the devil, by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony.

    This leads to ask this question, “How did they overcome the devil with the blood of the Lamb?”

    The only answer is through the Eucharist, which is the English translation of the Greek word, eucharisto, and eucharistia which translates as “thanksgiving” and occurs throughout the New Testament.

    Since Jesus broke bread and said, “Take and eat, for this is My body, broken for you,” and taking the cup, He said, “Take and drink, all of you, for this is the shedding of My blood for the remission of sins,” and He commanded the disciples to do this often in remembrance of Him. St. Paul made this clear in his epistle this Thanksgiving food is so powerful it has caused some of the believers in the Church to die.

    Furthermore, the Church Fathers of the First Centuries understood this. From Justin Martyr, we have this quote:

    And this food is called among us εὐχαριστία [the Eucharist], of which no one is allowed to partake but the man who believes that the things which we teach are true, and who has been washed with the washing that is for the remission of sins, and unto regeneration, and who is so living as Christ has enjoined. For not as common bread and common drink do we receive these; but in like manner as Jesus Christ our Saviour, having been made flesh by the Word of God, had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so likewise have we been taught that the food which is blessed by the prayer of His word, and from which our blood and flesh by transmutation are nourished, is the flesh and blood of that Jesus who was made flesh. For the apostles, in the memoirs composed by them, which are called Gospels, have thus delievered unto us what was enjoined upon them; that Jesus took bread, and when He had given thanks, said, “This do ye in remembrance of Me, this is My body;” and that, after the same manner, having taken the cup and given thanks, He said, “This is My blood;” and gave it to them alone. The First Apology of Justin, Chapter LXVI

    St. Irenaeus said:

    But vain in every respect are they who despise the entire dispensation of God, and disallow the salvation of the flesh, and treat with contempt its regeneration, maintaining that it is not capable of incorruption. But if this indeed do not attain salvation, then neither did the Lord redeem us with His blookd, nor is the cup of the Eucharist the communion of His blood, nor the bread which we break the communion of His body. For blood can only come from veins and flesh, and whatsoever else makes up the substance of man, such as the Word of God was actually made. By His own blood he redeemed us, also His apostle declares, “In whom we have redemption through His blood, even the remission of sins.” And as we are His members, we are also nourished by means of the creation (and He Himself grants the creation to us, for He causes His sun to rise, and sends rain when He wills). He has acknowledged the cup (which is part of the creation) as His own blood, from which He bedews our blood; and the bread (also a part of the creation) He has established as His own body, from which He gives increase to our bodies. When, therefore, the mingled cup and the manufactured bread receives the Word of God, and the Eucharist of the blood and the body of Christ is made, from which things the substance of our flesh is increased and supported, how can they affirm that the flesh is incapable of receiving the gift of God, which is life eternal…? Against Heresies: Book V, Chapter II

    Finally, from the Anglican’s Book of Common Prayer, we would pray after receiving the communion:

    Almighty and everlasting God, we most heartily thank thee, for that thou dost vouchsafe to feed us who have duly received these holy mysteries, with the spiritual food of the most precious Body and Blood of thy Son our Saviour Jesus Christ; and dost assure us thereby of thy favour and goodness towards us; and that we are very members incorporate in the mystical body of thy Son, which is the blessed company of all faithful people; and are also heirs through ope of thy everlasting kingdom, by the merits of his most precious death and passion. And we humbly beseech thee, O heavenly Father, so to assist us with thy grace, that we may continue in that holy fellowship, and do all such good works as thou hast prepared for us to walk; through Jesus Christ our Lord, to whom, with thee and the Holy Ghost, be all honour and glory, world without end. Amen.

    It is clear from three sources I have cited there is a very, unshakable and strong belief that the Eucharist is the life-giving food that we partake of.

    You, on the other hand, like Gnostics before you, have completely rejected this. Since the time of the Apostles and their generation of bishops who were and are succeeded by bishops after them, they fought against heretics who denied the Eucharist as life-giving food, and they refused to deny the faith because Jesus made it perfectly clear in John 6 and in the Last Supper that the Bread and Blood is His body.

    I look forward to the day I finally partake in the Sacraments and I will be giving profuse thanks to the Lord Jesus Christ for granting me my innermost longing, that is to partake in the Thanksgiving feast of His life-giving Body and Blood so in the last day, He may rise me to everlasting life.

  • Kamau41

    Salvation is a lifelong process.

  • Vinny Zee

    “Since distinguished theologians & bible scholars have long observed, that “Scripture will always interpret Scripture.” I can tell you right now friend, if any “distinguished” scholar has observed this in scripture you need to stop calling them “distinguished.” Please point us to which book or which verse in scripture says, “scripture interprets scripture?” This is the biggest fallacy and lie of the protestant reformation. If you want to talk about traditions of men, “Scripture interprets scripture” is it. The bible NEVER makes such a claim.

    “You now have the unenviable task of reconciling, in appropriate context too, just a small-sampling of (2 Tim. 3:16-17) Holy Spirit “breathed” Truth from the Word of God.” You actually have the unenviable task of proving we can not look to scripture and tradition as our authorities to interpret and understand what has been passed down. What Protestants have is “the bible of myself, for myself and by myself.” That is the unenviable position to be in.

    You quote Proverbs 30:5-6. Did you not add to his words by saying “scripture interprets scripture?”

  • Vinny Zee

    1. Please stop lying and saying scripture interprets scripture.
    2. Jesus gave authority to the church. Acts 15 is a clear example of this. After hearing the testimonies, considering the Gentile converts, Peter then makes a decision the church would no longer practice circumcision. Circumcision has not been practice since. After the decision was made, then in Acts 15:15 the referenced where the Prophets agree with this. They did not go to “sola scriptura” to make the decision.
    3. This church, founded by Christ, is still here with the same authority that it has had. It has four distinct marks, One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic.

    This list could go on, but I’ll keep it brief as it looks like you have your hands full with Walid as it is.

    • Vinny Zee

      Not so fast DavidRev17. In one regard I’d like to commend how you consider historical implications of certain texts. However, my ears unfortunately stop short when I see you resorting to history on one hand and “sola Scriptura” on another hand. It is a foregone fact and conclusion this principal was borne out of the Reformation. There is not one church father prior to the reformation who taught us “sola scriptura.” Yes, guys like James White and many other modern day protestants will attempt to cherry pick Fathers such as Cyril of Jerusalem at some points where they discuss the importance, sufficiency or inerrant of scripture and attempt to show us the Fathers were themselves sola scriptura advocates. If anyone looks at the entire body of evidence of John MacArthur for example, he is a Calvinist back and forth, up and down, inside and out. This goes for the church fathers. In the overall analysis of their writings, discussions and teachings, they are thoroughly Catholic.

      Paul was clear to the Thessalonians in 2 Ths 2:15, he told them to hold to the traditions, whether taught orally or by letter. Paul never made any statements (nor did any other New Testament writer) that God was going to close the canon of scripture and after that they were to follow only the scripture. This principle was introduced late in Church history by protestants to try to undo the authority of the Church. Acts Chapter 15 was the first council and no it was not determined by the principle of sola scriptura. They gathered the testimony, they listened, they made a decision then they appealed also to scripture to back up their authority to make the decision they did. Not only do you hijack the church fathers (who are our Fathers by the way because you reject the Catholic church) you cannot show one verse that actually teaches anyone what sola scriptura is or how it is supposed to work. Every scripture and interpretation you put forth, you did so in an anachronistic fashion (i.e. you’ve read your interpretation into the scripture while trying to convince us “the scripture interprets the scripture.”)

      Paul stated in 1 Cor 11:1-2, he called them to imitate him, as he imitated Christ and he praised the Corinthians for holding to the traditions, “just as he passed them on” to them. This is what led St. Basil the Great to boldly declare, when considering what Paul said here, “Of the beliefs and practices whether generally accepted or enjoined which are preserved in the Church, some we possess derived from written teaching, others we have delivered to us in a mystery by the apostles by the tradition of the apostles and both of these in relation to true religion have the same force.” Finally he said, “For I hold it apostolic to abide by the unwritten traditions” and in making this statement Basil referred back to 1 Cor 11:1-2 and 2 Ths 2:15.

      Peter warned in 2 Peter 1:20-21 that no prophecy of scripture is of any private interpretation. A careful examination by Catholics of all of the “sola scriptura” interpretations by Protestants over the last 500 years has only revealed a miss-mash of interpretations on almost every conceivable doctrine; interpretations without cohesion. Men and Women sitting alone, or in “bible study” coming up with private interpretations and starting churches and movements at whims because they think, “God told them to do so.” Along with Peter’s warning, “There are some things in Paul’s letters hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, beware lest you be carried away with the error of lawless men and lose your own stability.” (2 Peter 3:15-17). We lean on the Scripture, the Tradition, the Church, the Fathers and our Own Magisterium to clear up controversies rather than sit around and think up fancy concocted explanations of Holy Scripture.

      Finally, you need to understand what the Catholic Church not only teaches about but understands by the inerrancy of Holy Scripture. The Catholic Church holds that in order to properly understand the meaning of Scripture, the Church must have recourse to and rely on its living Tradition. This is scriptural as I quoted earlier. Every heretical sect that has ever existed makes an appeal to scripture. From Arius to the Mormons. Anyone claiming to be the real Christians with the real interpretation all appeal to the scripture alone to prove their claims. The Catholic Church makes no such error. We hold to the Scripture in its entirety as inerrant and infallible. However, we understand that scripture in light of the Church’s Holy Tradition as passed on by the apostles. Protestant groups all, in one way or another, depart from Holy Tradition in their attempts to understand the scriptures. Don’t believe me. Check the Protestant beliefs on Mary’s ever Virgin state, her Immaculate Conception, Her assumption (or dormition), the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist, Confession, Baptism, Holy Orders, Sacraments, the Mass, etc. The list goes on; i.e. the list goes on as to who Protestants reject these Holy and Sacred Traditions that help us define our faith that you all claim, “I don’t see that in the bible.”

      Protestants love to make great boasts about the Canon of Scripture (given by the Catholic Church), the Trinity (Given by the Catholic Church in her Holy and Ecumenical Councils). You all love to cite the “books of the Bible” yet the bible has no infallible list of those books. It was the Catholic Church which declared and protected the New Testament Canon. How do Protestants make such great boasts about the fact that 11 of the 12 apostles were martyred, when the bible gives us no such fact? Who provided those facts to you? How can Protestants greatly boast about the Trinity while Mormons and Jehovah’s Witnesses look at those same scriptures to deny the Trinity? Protestants can win that argument because they have the defined doctrine protected, explained and given by the Catholic Church.

      How do you know Matthew wrote the book of Matthew? You confidently, “in the Gospel of Matthew, chapter this and verse that.” Where does Matthew say it is his Gospel? What we have is the clear tradition in the church from the earliest possible date that Matthew wrote the book. This tradition goes all the way back to Papias in about AD 130. Matthew was quoted by Clement by the very late 1st century AD, so we know it was written and already considered “scripture” in the late first century. Have you ever read the “scholarly” debates about who really wrote the Gospel of John? Who is the “disciple whom Jesus loved?” All we know is that the person who wrote it down was an eye witness whom Jesus also loved. Is it not the Catholic church that preserved for you it was John?

      So in the final analysis you attempt a slight of hand by telling us we are missing the historical record of Acts 15 because we have not accurately applied the standard of Sola Scriptura. However, you need to re-evaluate your history and understanding of the Church. You need to abandon your unbiblical “sola scriptura” principles and begin understanding the scriptures in the light of the history and tradition of the Church that has the authority to provide the correct interpretation.

  • Grandmere

    Christ was pierced and there came forth blood and WATER. The thief was still alive when this happened. Do you think a drop of that holy water did not land on the thief?

  • “re-read (Acts 15) very carefully.”

    And you re-read the REST of scripture carefully.

    Case closed.

    • Vinny Zee

      I also wanted to reply. His comments are in my notifications, but I see they are awaiting moderation still on this page, so it won’t let me reply.

  • Vinny Zee

    Not so fast DavidRev17. In one regard I’d like to commend how you consider historical implications of certain texts. However, my ears unfortunately stop short when I see you resorting to history on one hand and “sola Scriptura” on another hand. It is a foregone fact and conclusion this principal was borne out of the Reformation. There is not one church father prior to the reformation who taught us “sola scriptura.” Yes, guys like James White and many other modern day protestants will attempt to cherry pick Fathers such as Cyril of Jerusalem at some points where they discuss the importance, sufficiency or inerrant of scripture and attempt to show us the Fathers were themselves sola scriptura advocates. If anyone looks at the entire body of evidence of John MacArthur for example, he is a Calvinist back and forth, up and down, inside and out. This goes for the church fathers. In the overall analysis of their writings, discussions and teachings, they are thoroughly Catholic.

    Paul was clear to the Thessalonians in 2 Ths 2:15, he told them to hold to the traditions, whether taught orally or by letter. Paul never made any statements (nor did any other New Testament writer) that God was going to close the canon of scripture and after that they were to follow only the scripture. This principle was introduced late in Church history by protestants to try to undo the authority of the Church. Acts Chapter 15 was the first council and no it was not determined by the principle of sola scriptura. They gathered the testimony, they listened, they made a decision then they appealed also to scripture to back up their authority to make the decision they did. Not only do you hijack the church fathers (who are our Fathers by the way because you reject the Catholic church) you cannot show one verse that actually teaches anyone what sola scriptura is or how it is supposed to work. Every scripture and interpretation you put forth, you did so in an anachronistic fashion (i.e. you’ve read your interpretation into the scripture while trying to convince us “the scripture interprets the scripture.”)

    Paul stated in 1 Cor 11:1-2, he called them to imitate him, as he imitated Christ and he praised the Corinthians for holding to the traditions, “just as he passed them on” to them. This is what led St. Basil the Great to boldly declare, when considering what Paul said here, “Of the beliefs and practices whether generally accepted or enjoined which are preserved in the Church, some we possess derived from written teaching, others we have delivered to us in a mystery by the apostles by the tradition of the apostles and both of these in relation to true religion have the same force.” Finally he said, “For I hold it apostolic to abide by the unwritten traditions” and in making this statement Basil referred back to 1 Cor 11:1-2 and 2 Ths 2:15.

    Peter warned in 2 Peter 1:20-21 that no prophecy of scripture is of any private interpretation. A careful examination by Catholics of all of the “sola scriptura” interpretations by Protestants over the last 500 years has only revealed a miss-mash of interpretations on almost every conceivable doctrine; interpretations without cohesion. Men and Women sitting alone, or in “bible study” coming up with private interpretations and starting churches and movements at whims because they think, “God told them to do so.” Along with Peter’s warning, “There are some things in Paul’s letters hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, beware lest you be carried away with the error of lawless men and lose your own stability.” (2 Peter 3:15-17). We lean on the Scripture, the Tradition, the Church, the Fathers and our Own Magisterium to clear up controversies rather than sit around and think up fancy concocted explanations of Holy Scripture.

    Finally, you need to understand what the Catholic Church not only teaches about but understands by the inerrancy of Holy Scripture. The Catholic Church holds that in order to properly understand the meaning of Scripture, the Church must have recourse to and rely on its living Tradition. This is scriptural as I quoted earlier. Every heretical sect that has ever existed makes an appeal to scripture. From Arius to the Mormons. Anyone claiming to be the real Christians with the real interpretation all appeal to the scripture alone to prove their claims. The Catholic Church makes no such error. We hold to the Scripture in its entirety as inerrant and infallible. However, we understand that scripture in light of the Church’s Holy Tradition as passed on by the apostles. Protestant groups all, in one way or another, depart from Holy Tradition in their attempts to understand the scriptures. Don’t believe me. Check the Protestant beliefs on Mary’s ever Virgin state, her Immaculate Conception, Her assumption (or dormition), the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist, Confession, Baptism, Holy Orders, Sacraments, the Mass, etc. The list goes on; i.e. the list goes on as to who Protestants reject these Holy and Sacred Traditions that help us define our faith that you all claim, “I don’t see that in the bible.”

    Protestants love to make great boasts about the Canon of Scripture (given by the Catholic Church), the Trinity (Given by the Catholic Church in her Holy and Ecumenical Councils). You all love to cite the “books of the Bible” yet the bible has no infallible list of those books. It was the Catholic Church which declared and protected the New Testament Canon. How do Protestants make such great boasts about the fact that 11 of the 12 apostles were martyred, when the bible gives us no such fact? Who provided those facts to you? How can Protestants greatly boast about the Trinity while Mormons and Jehovah’s Witnesses look at those same scriptures to deny the Trinity? Protestants can win that argument because they have the defined doctrine protected, explained and given by the Catholic Church.

    How do you know Matthew wrote the book of Matthew? You confidently, “in the Gospel of Matthew, chapter this and verse that.” Where does Matthew say it is his Gospel? What we have is the clear tradition in the church from the earliest possible date that Matthew wrote the book. This tradition goes all the way back to Papias in about AD 130. Matthew was quoted by Clement by the very late 1st century AD, so we know it was written and already considered “scripture” in the late first century. Have you ever read the “scholarly” debates about who really wrote the Gospel of John? Who is the “disciple whom Jesus loved?” All we know is that the person who wrote it down was an eye witness whom Jesus also loved. Is it not the Catholic church that preserved for you it was John?

    So in the final analysis you attempt a slight of hand by telling us we are missing the historical record of Acts 15 because we have not accurately applied the standard of Sola Scriptura. However, you need to re-evaluate your history and understanding of the Church. You need to abandon your unbiblical “sola scriptura” principles and begin understanding the scriptures in the light of the history and tradition of the Church that has the authority to provide the correct interpretation.

  • Grandmere

    Actually, it’s a cast iron skillet.

  • Vinny Zee

    Not so fast DavidRev17. In one regard I’d like to commend how you consider historical implications of certain texts. However, my ears unfortunately stop short when I see you resorting to history on one hand and “sola Scriptura” on another hand. It is a foregone fact and conclusion this principal was borne out of the Reformation. There is not one church father prior to the reformation who taught us “sola scriptura.” Yes, guys like James White and many other modern day protestants will attempt to cherry pick Fathers such as Cyril of Jerusalem at some points where they discuss the importance, sufficiency or inerrant of scripture and attempt to show us the Fathers were themselves sola scriptura advocates. If anyone looks at the entire body of evidence of John MacArthur for example, he is a Calvinist back and forth, up and down, inside and out. This goes for the church fathers. In the overall analysis of their writings, discussions and teachings, they are thoroughly Catholic.

    Paul was clear to the Thessalonians in 2 Ths 2:15, he told them to hold to the traditions, whether taught orally or by letter. Paul never made any statements (nor did any other New Testament writer) that God was going to close the canon of scripture and after that they were to follow only the scripture. This principle was introduced late in Church history by protestants to try to undo the authority of the Church. Acts Chapter 15 was the first council and no it was not determined by the principle of sola scriptura. They gathered the testimony, they listened, they made a decision then they appealed also to scripture to back up their authority to make the decision they did. Not only do you hijack the church fathers (who are our Fathers by the way because you reject the Catholic church) you cannot show one verse that actually teaches anyone what sola scriptura is or how it is supposed to work. Every scripture and interpretation you put forth, you did so in an anachronistic fashion (i.e. you’ve read your interpretation into the scripture while trying to convince us “the scripture interprets the scripture.”)

    Paul stated in 1 Cor 11:1-2, he called them to imitate him, as he imitated Christ and he praised the Corinthians for holding to the traditions, “just as he passed them on” to them. This is what led St. Basil the Great to boldly declare, when considering what Paul said here, “Of the beliefs and practices whether generally accepted or enjoined which are preserved in the Church, some we possess derived from written teaching, others we have delivered to us in a mystery by the apostles by the tradition of the apostles and both of these in relation to true religion have the same force.” Finally he said, “For I hold it apostolic to abide by the unwritten traditions” and in making this statement Basil referred back to 1 Cor 11:1-2 and 2 Ths 2:15.

    Peter warned in 2 Peter 1:20-21 that no prophecy of scripture is of any private interpretation. A careful examination by Catholics of all of the “sola scriptura” interpretations by Protestants over the last 500 years has only revealed a miss-mash of interpretations on almost every conceivable doctrine; interpretations without cohesion. Men and Women sitting alone, or in “bible study” coming up with private interpretations and starting churches and movements at whims because they think, “God told them to do so.” Along with Peter’s warning, “There are some things in Paul’s letters hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, beware lest you be carried away with the error of lawless men and lose your own stability.” (2 Peter 3:15-17). We lean on the Scripture, the Tradition, the Church, the Fathers and our Own Magisterium to clear up controversies rather than sit around and think up fancy concocted explanations of Holy Scripture.
    Finally, you need to understand what the Catholic Church not only teaches about but understands by the inerrancy of Holy Scripture. The Catholic Church holds that in order to properly understand the meaning of Scripture, the Church must have recourse to and rely on its living Tradition. This is scriptural as I quoted earlier. Every heretical sect that has ever existed makes an appeal to scripture. From Arius to the Mormons. Anyone claiming to be the real Christians with the real interpretation all appeal to the scripture alone to prove their claims. The Catholic Church makes no such error. We hold to the Scripture in its entirety as inerrant and infallible. However, we understand that scripture in light of the Church’s Holy Tradition as passed on by the apostles. Protestant groups all, in one way or another, depart from Holy Tradition in their attempts to understand the scriptures. Don’t believe me. Check the Protestant beliefs on Mary’s ever Virgin state, her Immaculate Conception, Her assumption (or dormition), the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist, Confession, Baptism, Holy Orders, Sacraments, the Mass, etc. The list goes on; i.e. the list goes on as to who Protestants reject these Holy and Sacred Traditions that help us define our faith that you all claim, “I don’t see that in the bible.”

    Protestants love to make great boasts about the Canon of Scripture (given by the Catholic Church), the Trinity (Given by the Catholic Church in her Holy and Ecumenical Councils). You all love to cite the “books of the Bible” yet the bible has no infallible list of those books. It was the Catholic Church which declared and protected the New Testament Canon. How do Protestants make such great boasts about the fact that 11 of the 12 apostles were martyred, when the bible gives us no such fact? Who provided those facts to you? How can Protestants greatly boast about the Trinity while Mormons and Jehovah’s Witnesses look at those same scriptures to deny the Trinity? Protestants can win that argument because they have the defined doctrine protected, explained and given by the Catholic Church.

    How do you know Matthew wrote the book of Matthew? You may confidently say, “in the Gospel of Matthew, chapter this and verse that.” But, where does Matthew say in his Gospel he is the author? What we have is the clear tradition in the church from the earliest possible date that Matthew wrote the book. This tradition goes all the way back to Papias in about AD 130. Matthew was quoted by Clement by the very late 1st century AD, so we know it was written and already considered “scripture” in the late first century. Have you ever read the “scholarly” debates about who really wrote the Gospel of John? Who is the “disciple whom Jesus loved?” All we know is that the person who wrote it down was an eye witness whom Jesus also loved. Is it not the Catholic church that preserved for you it was John?

    So in the final analysis you attempt a slight of hand by telling us we are missing the historical record of Acts 15 because we have not accurately applied the standard of Sola Scriptura. However, you need to re-evaluate your history and understanding of the Church. You need to abandon your unbiblical “sola scriptura” principles and begin understanding the scriptures in the light of the history and tradition of the Church that has the authority to provide the correct interpretation.

    • Always love reading the works of the Wise Vinny Zee.

      • Vinny Zee

        I have men wiser than me to thank. Namely those through the centuries who did not bend their knee. I was glad when I saw this article because I felt like I had not seen anything from you in a while. So I figured you were on a sabbatical from writing to handle other issues. Of course the rest of your staff does a fantastic job presenting articles. But the Falafel stand seems to be missing something when you’re not around.

  • davidrev17

    I’ve made my point clearly; which is why I don’t find heresy – when it comes to “…THE faith once and for all delivered unto the saints” (Jude 3) – to be just blithely swept-under-the-rug by anyone of whom sets themselves up, as some sort of an authority on theological issues – particularly when the issue is soteriological! (See James/Jacob 3:1 in this context.)

    If what Walid is proclaiming as “true,” when it comes to providing the correct answer to the question – “what must I do to be saved”? (i.e., Acts 16:31-32) – then we might as well just set-fire to the Word of the Living God; because both messages (the Catholic & the Biblical), couldn’t possibly be any more diametrically opposed to one another.

    And the “Spirit of Truth” Himself is simply NOT the “Author of confusion,” contradiction, nor error; so both messages can’t possibly be logically and/or rationally correct at the same time, and in the same sense! (Surely you can discern at least that much??)

    • “”…THE faith once and for all delivered unto the saints” (Jude 3) – to be just blithely swept-under-the-rug by anyone of whom sets themselves up, as some sort of an authority on theological issues ”

      This authority would be you, right?

    • “what must I do to be saved? (i.e., Acts 16:31-32)”

      Excuse me david, when did our article speak about the issue of salvation? Why are grasshoppers always when one brings up a subject contrary to their worldview, they always drill to this subject?

      The issue is the tangible with the spiritual. The Gnostics reject the tangible. Do you agree with them or do you disagree with them?

      Apparently you do. 100%

      Thats it.

      What are grasshoppers always roaming roundabout with a booklet that speaks on Salvation when we have a Bible that speaks on salvation and MORE: how God wants us to conduct our service to Him.

      So STOP going around in circles.

      I will not doubt that if you lived in ancient Israel, would have considered Moses an idolater when he “made a serpent of brass, and put it upon a pole,” so “that if a serpent had bitten any man, when he beheld the serpent of brass, he lived.” (Numbers 21:9)

      It is said that God cannot use objects, but Jesus’ garment was physical, and when a woman who was subject to bleeding touched it, “immediately her bleeding stopped.” (Luke 8:43)

      St. Peter’s shadow did not stop the earliest Christians when they “brought forth the sick into the streets, and laid them on beds and couches, that at the least the shadow of Peter passing by might overshadow some of them.” (Acts 5:15)

      Aprons and handkerchiefs are physical objects, but this did not prevent the Apostles, since they “brought unto the sick handkerchiefs or aprons, and the diseases departed from them, and the evil spirits went out of them.” (Acts 19:12)
      So here is my question: where these object PHYSICAL? Yes or No?
      Did God honor such practice? Yes or No.

      Its a Yes or No. Any other subject is irrelevant because grasshoppers will always change subjects and never answer questions.

      That is how you recognize a grasshopper.

  • “I don’t agree with everything Walid says”

    How can I remedy this so that you agree with me 100%

    🙂

    Just kidding.

  • “MAN DOES NOT LIVE BY BREAD ALONE, BUT MAN LIVES BY EVERY WORD THAT COMES FROM THE MOUTH OF THE LORD.”

    You posted this quote. I presented several quotes which you did not address.

    I presented several verses in my article which argue that gnostics ignore the tangible.

    I also wrote:

    “This is why in every dialogue between Christian and grasshopper, that whenever you quote verses with the tangible, they will always counter with the spiritual.

    But grasshoppers do not follow scripture despite them saying that they do.

    They don’t. So where did all this limited and selective interpretation of God’s Word stem from?

    It stems from the doctrines of men whom they do not even know or have ever read about. No reader of history can write about Protestantism without writing, at least briefly, on the pre-Reformation heretics. Catharism “the pure ones” was a Christian dualist or Gnostic revival movement that thrived in some areas of Southern Europe, particularly northern Italy and southern France between the 12th and 14th centuries. The followers were known as Cathars and are now mainly remembered for a prolonged period of persecution by the Catholic church which did not recognise their belief as truly Christian. The Cathars actually became the grasshoppers martyrs. You can read all about these here.

    But how can these be ‘martyrs’ especially after studying what is rarely discussed. What one will find in this history, is that the roots of Protestantism is gnosticism from the Cathars, or the belief that Christ was not physical, but a phantom.

    To reject the physical Humanity of Christ, would then lead to the rejection of the main sacraments, the Eucharist, Confession, icons and holy water which all these were clearly defined in scripture.

    The devil by having his apostolates ignore the tangible parts of scripture it resulted in agnosticism. When perusing their history, one will find that these pre-Reformation sects rejected crucifixes, icons, Confession and the Eucharist.

    In other words, they rejected the tangible.”

    You reject the tangible. Take for example Aprons and handkerchiefs are physical objects, but this did not prevent the Apostles, since they “brought unto the sick handkerchiefs or aprons, and the diseases departed from them, and the evil spirits went out of them.” (Acts 19:12)

    This is from the Word of God which you quoted “MAN DOES NOT LIVE BY BREAD ALONE, BUT MAN LIVES BY EVERY WORD THAT COMES FROM THE MOUTH OF THE LORD.”

    These aprons are in the Word of God.

    Yet no matter what I do, you will simply quote the spiritual verses. I stated:

    “that whenever you quote verses with the tangible, they will always counter with the spiritual.”

    I was right. I do not need to address Acts for I agree with you on Acts.

    Where we disagree is regarding the tangible.

    Stick with the subject or else I will let you have your last words and put the matter on ignore.